[Dan James]

I realise  there's a bit of a crossover here with adamfarr's "Come on steal the noise" topic. However, I think it's sufficiently different to merit its own thread.

A wonderful sounding word, sibilance - for me, it conjures up images of Basil trying to deal with his wife in 'Fawlty Towers'. But when it comes to the realm of recording, I find it a total pain in the backside.

Maybe I've got a naturally hissy singing voice - don't see how I can change that. Maybe I'm singing too close to the mike - yes, but that's the kind of sound I like to get. Pop filters and foam mike condoms don't work - they're fine with plosives, but don't even put a dent in those hissy 'ssss' and 'shhhh' sounds. Same with singing across, rather than into, the mike.

I also have problems using the de-esser plugin in Logic Pro X - when I crank it up high enough to take the offending sounds out, it makes it sound like I'm lisping. Also, it seems, all the 'ssss' and 'shhhh' sounds are not necessarily within the same narrow frequency bandwidth - some get reduced, others don't. Trying to adjust the EQ is another way I've tried, but however narrow the frequency bandwidth that I'm trying to suppress, it usually tends to make it sound like I'm singing from behind a wet blanket - muffled and indistinct.

Ideally, I'd like to eliminate the problem at source, and am wondering whether it's a microphone problem. I tend to use my trusty old SM 58 for vocals (and for acoustic guitar, if it comes to that, but that's another story), but even when I use my only other mike, an AKG Perception 120, I still get the same problem. As for interface, I'm using a Yamaha MW 10C mixer, and I tend to leave the 'High', 'Medium' and 'Low' settings smack-bang in the middle.

So - over to you guys. Is there a silver bullet? (Perhaps that should read 'sssssilver bullet').

[pompeyjazz]

Well I have really suffered from this. It's a terrible affliction  Have been playing with some de-esser VST's yesterday evening, namely Tonmann DeEsser and Spitfish (Wonderful names don't you think)

I need some more time to experiment fully but a promising start

John

[Boydie]

I am not sure changing hardware (mic) is going to make much of a difference

My own approach is to use a de-esser on relatively gentle settings (certainly a way short of "lisping"!)

If there is any sibilance left that still pokes through the mix and annoys me I will zoom in to the WAV file and use volume automation to manually pull down the volume of anything that still pokes through - eg individual "s" sounds

The advantage of this approach is that it still leaves the "s" sound (or other offending noise) but it is far less annoying

[Dan James]

Boydie: Cheers for the response. I used to use Audacity as an external editor from the DAW I was using at the time (Mixcraft), to do what you're saying - zoom in to the individual 's/sh' sounds and pull down the volume. The wave patterns for those sounds are fairly chunky and easy to find, but it's a helluva long-winded chore, even in a 3-minute song.  However, I did think, while I was writing my post, that maybe that's what I ought to get back to.

pompeyjazz - I'll check out the de-essers you mention. Maybe they're more sensitive than the standard Logic Pro de-esser.

[Boydie]

but it's a helluva long-winded chore, even in a 3-minute song

Absolutely - but that is what it often takes to get a really good sounding vocal

IMHO it is worth spending this attention to detail on the lead vocal as it is often the focus of the song

You could combine it with fine tuning any other vocal automation - eg bringing up the volume at the end of words to ensure every syllable is clearly heard

This not only gives you a better vocal but it will also mean that other compressors etc. will not need to work so hard

It is often these little details that make a mix "pro sounding"

[Paulski]

Hi Dan

Well you could always take all the S's out of your lyrics or just sing a lot of "woah's" like a lot of pop songs do these days

Seriously though, I use the 3 band vocal compression in izotope's VST - but sometimes I even have to increase the S's after having done so - as it can be very aggressive. I'm sure if I spent some time I could find its sweet spot.

Good subject!
cheers
Paul

[Dan James]

Paulski

Well you could always take all the S's out of your lyrics

Don't think i haven't thought of that - I thought about writing a song with no S's once, just as a silly exercise - got about as far as line 3, then went down the pub.

[shadowfax]

I don't use de essers..I go throught the WAV file and reduce all problem plosives and esses with automation..
as boydie said..it's the only way..

[Frenchy]

not much more to add, only that sometimes it doesnn't sound too bad in places and can add a bit of character, listen to SEAL, not done him any harm.

Regards,
Frenchy