[RobA]

Hi Folks,
I'm hoping for a little help and some recommendations for equipment for me to update my recording capabilities.  I have a pretty old set up which I put together about 10 years ago, and have only updated in minor ways since.  It was at the time mainly for the purpose of recording rough demos and basic songwriting, before getting into a room with the band and developing the bass, drums and lead guitar parts with the other members.  However, I'd like to update my gear so I can compose and record complete songs.

Current kit consists of:

Computer: (old but upgraded - can't upgrade anymore) Window 10 PC AMD 64 bit 3200 processor with 2 Gb RAM
DAW: Adobe Audition 1.0 for multitrack recording
Interface: Edirol Firewire FA101 interface
Monitors: Fostex pm0.4 desktop mounted  (on home made foam pads)
Mic: AKG D5
Basic headphones: Sennheiser HD202

My budget is probably to spend around £1000 - 1500 over the next 6 months to get up to a good home studio set up, suitable for guitar based singer songwriter recording fairly live sounding tracks.

My thoughts...
Computer:  New PC or MAC required (we need this anyway so will be a big portion of the budget) - I'm considering Mac Book Pro? - want a laptop for portability, any recommendations?
DAW: I've tried Audacity and didn't like it anywhere near as much as Adobe Audition.  I'd like to stay with Adobe if at all possible if staying with PC - could I get an older version of Adobe e.g. 3?
If I go to Mac I'll just use garage band initially, but may go with Logic later.
Interface: I'm hoping to stick with my FA101.  Use a Firewire adaptor to Thunderbold if I go to Mac - does this work ok in anyone's experience?
Monitors: stay as is?
New Mic and headphones for vocal recording: Need a decent studio mic - recommendations? Spend around £100- 200?
Plus some basics like shock mount and pop shield.

Anyone advice on fairly good but still entry level home studio kit much appreciated.
Thank you,
Rob

[Boydie]

We can definitely identify the perfect setup for you at the right price

Off the top of my head...

I am a PC guy but if you get a Mac you may as well pay the extra few quid and get Logic from the get go

Garage Band is fine but you may as well get something you can grow in to


I would spend some time understanding the difference between a digital multi track recorder (eg Audition) and a fully fledged DAW (Digital Audio Workstation)

A lot has changed in the last 10 years and you will be amazed at what software can do now - for a few hundred £ you can get what would have cost many thousands a few years ago

I would recommend checking out Cakewalk Sonar, Reaper, Cubase, Studio One etc.

These are proper DAWs and will allow you to use virtual instruments (drums, pianos, synths and any other instrument you can imagine) allowing you to mix these virtual instruments with your real recorded playing

These virtual instruments are usually driven by MIDI where you can either record a performance as MIDI, use MIDI patterns from libraries, or even convert audio to MIDI if you have the right tools

Before going any further could you provide details of EXACTLY what you want to achieve with your new setup and your experience with playing (are you a keyboard player, guitarist etc.)

How do you plan to record the songs on your own?

What genre of music do you want to produce?

I want to make sure we steer you in the right direction as the choices available are massive and probably very confusing and daunting

We can definitely steer you down the right path so don't worry!

[manninomusic]

For a microphone suggestion, i would suggest a Blue Spark condenser. I am quite pleased with the sound, but it is extremely sensitive, and will pick up any movement within your room, so be careful. In my opinion, that microphone is priced for our home recording studios, most of us cant afford neumann, and after researching online, there is very little difference between neumann mic quality and blue spark. Some people were actually saying that this Blue Spark compares to it, but its two different price ranges completly and I would assume that a $3000 mic is 100% better then a $200 mic. That being said, it doesent mean you cant make good recordings with a $200 mic

[tone]

I would assume that a $3000 mic is 100% better then a $200 mic. That being said, it doesent mean you cant make good recordings with a $200 mic

Of course I would expect something costing 3k to be better than something costing 200, but there are many more things to take into consideration here.

Most important in my opinion once you get into the world of condenser mics is the quality of the space you record in. If your room has loads of ugly reflections or is poorly built/ insulated/ whatever, then your recording isn't going to to sound great, even if you use a Neumann. I've experienced this personally. I've recorded using Neumann's twice, once in a great studio with a brilliant sound, once in a not-so-great studio with a less-than-brilliant engineer. The second time the sound was horrible.

As you say, the mic picks up everything, so use it carefully! Personally I believe the quality of the performance is far more important than the quality (price) of the equipment used to record it once you get above a certain level. Even an SM58/57 is capable of capturing a record-quality vocal take if you know how to use it to its full potential. Check out this page http://shureblog.co.uk/sometimes-all-you-need-is-an-sm58/#.VdXvB0uXoYU

My SM58 cost me about £70. Would I like a more expensive mic? Yes I would, but not as much as I'd like a nice expensive studio in which to use it :p

[Jamie]

Hi , I recently upgraded my studio and I've got a Mac desktop with Logic Pro x which I'm really pleased with. My  mic is an SE2200T which is a valve condenser mic which from memory cost me around £250 and I think it is an excellent mic for the money!
But there are lots of options!
Cheers
Jamie

[RobA]

Hi All,
Thank you so much for the replies, already helping.

So to give you some idea of what I'm aiming it...here are some links to my songs wrote and recorded a few years back...I'm at this stage looking to write and record in a similar musical style..., I just want to get right back into it, either collaborating virtually or local with others, or by using virtual instruments for drums, and bass myself.  I sing and play guitar, mainly acoustic but some electric. A lot of my songs are in Open C tuning, so I'll want a pretty genuine acoustic sound, mixture of fingerstyle and full open sounding chords.  But don't assume it's quiet...have a listen below.

So, here is an original recording of a song called Average Man just after I wrote it, recorded on my home PC with roughly the setup I listed...
https://soundcloud.com/rob-309/average-man-demo/s-V7EQQ

Which after development with the band and a day in a local studio became this...
https://soundcloud.com/rob-309/average-man-ors/s-n30Ps

More examples of what I'm aiming at for end recording results and musical style from that same studio session:
Utopia: https://soundcloud.com/rob-309/utopia-ors/s-qLjKa
Freedom and Adventure: https://soundcloud.com/rob-309/freedom-and-adventure-ors
Signs: https://soundcloud.com/rob-309/signs-ors/s-hGDBL

(band was called One Random Sunday...mainly did local gigs but went our separate ways when kids and proper jobs came along etc. etc.).

Ok...so I now know the difference between a DAW and the multitrack recorder, how did I not know this , and agree I'll need a DAW for virtual instruments as I'll be starting off working on my own to develop my new material.  So if I go Mac, best to just get Logic Pro X in the package...got it.

My 'studio' environment:  I have a converted garage with a thick fire door attaching to the house and a timber partition wall (polystyrene filled) between the inside and a section still at the front of the garage for bikes and stuff opening to the street.  It's pretty insulated from outside noise (traffic etc.) but the chances of sound proofing it from the rest of the house are nil as I have stomping around young kids, so I'll just have to record when the family is out.  I've padded the partition wall with foam to act as thermal insulation but it also does a good job sound dampening as well (used packaging type foam that servers come packed in I got out of a skip(!) from my old employer).

So I think there is little point me spending near £400 - 500 on a condenser vocal mic, as my environment isn't really up to it...neither are my editing, mixing or master skills.  Better I think (?) to get a reasonable mic at the £200 mark, that's going to give me good results capturing my vocal range and style, and concentrating on the songwriting quality, playing, performance and emotion?

I will check out those mic options thanks, if you've any further ideas given the extra info that would be great.

p.s. I know I've linked loads of tracks here, I hope it's ok and not breaking the rules, if so, let me know once you've had a listen to get what I'm aiming at, and I can edit them out.

[Boydie]

No problem at all to post links to songs here as it will help us help you (and others in a similar position)

I use the same SE2200T tube condenser mic as JAMIE and it is great on vocals and acoustic guitar

Other good options are:

http://www.dv247.com/microphones/se-electronics-se-electronics-x1-large-diaphragm-condenser-microphone--68610

http://www.dv247.com/microphones/se-electronics-se-x1-vocal-pack--105393

http://www.dv247.com/microphones/se-electronics-se2200a-ii-multi-pattern-condenser-microphone--93284

http://www.dv247.com/microphones/rode-nt1-condenser-microphone--205966

http://www.dv247.com/microphones/rode-nt1-a-and-stand-bundle--97443

The packs with shock mount and integrated pop shield are probably the best option

If you record your vocals and guitar separately then you only need to buy one decent mic 

Your interface is a little old but will probably be fine if it works with the new Mac

I would say the only other things you need to get you up and running is Logic X

This will give you everything you need to start

My advice would be to hold off on buying any VSTs until you get to know Logic and what it has to offer as it may already have some good sounds (drums etc.)

I would suggest spending the money on some tuition for Logic X And your best investment would probably be an all access pass to https://www.groove3.com/

There are 35 videos dedicated to logic ( https://www.groove3.com/logic-training-videos ) as well as loads of "general principles" videos that are always helpful

You can start now so you can get your head around how to approach recording, mixing and producing in Logic X so you hit the ground running when you get your new setup

[Frenchy]

Hi my advice would be to subscribe to a blog called the therecordingrecordingrevolution.com, Graham Cocherane will give you lots of tips and inspiration on why expensive gear is not important to get great sounding recordnings, he also recommends gear for beginners. Also. for inspiration subscribe to Pensados Place on You Tube..

My set up :
Mac Pro. 3.1 2008 12gb RAM, desktop, (well powefull enough for 60 tracks plus ! If you dont want any fuss and are not really technical with computers, I'd go for the rock solid performace of a mac based system.
Logic Pro x (amazing), stock plugins and soft synths are good enough for anything I want to do, and a lot of my friends too.
RME Fireface interface (probably a bit pricey for you) I heard recently the focusrtite scarlet range, and I couldn't tell the difference !
Mic : Rode K2, again a bit pricey for you but I also believe the cheaper Rode NT1 is a great mic,  and I have also a Studio projects which both gives great results. At the end of the day, In my experience, it is what is it
is what is infront of the mic which much more important than the equipment.

Good luck
Frenchy

[shadowfax]

The best thing I ever did was build myself a soundbooth..cost around 200 Quid..well worth it..makes a mic sound ten times better.

[Dan James]

Frenchy mentioned therecordingrevolution.com, and I totally agree with him. Here's just one of Graham Cochrane's many excellent, no-nonsense and down to earth YouTube posts.