[wk]

Ever wanted to write a song, but not known how? This free online course will give you the practical and theoretical understanding you need to create a finished song of your own.

https://www.futurelearn.com/courses/songwriting

Duration: 6 weeks
3 hours per week
Start date: 8 Jun

Course description:

Over six weeks, we’ll be exploring the basic musical concepts that underpin successful songs. From the fundamental elements of melody, rhythm, harmony, metre and key, to the relationship between words and music.

We’ll uncover the tools and techniques that songwriters use to create effective melodies and discover how chords combine to give shape and structure to your songs. We’ll also learn how giving your song a musical form or structure can help to make it captivating and memorable.

Special guests include:

Martin Simpson (award-winning folk songwriter)
Tom Ravenscroft (BBC Radio 6 Music presenter)
Christopher Hague (Producer, Sheffield Steelworks Studios)
Shahbaz Hussein (Tabla player)
... and more

[Skub]

If you need a course on how to write a song,is that not a good indicator that your talents may lie elsewhere?

[seriousfun]

Since this is a songwriters forum, I take it as a given that everyone here is way past the first song stage.

[Sing4me88]

Since this is a songwriters forum, I take it as a given that everyone here is way past the first song stage.

Not necessarily- and I say this as a lyricist. It could help lyricists learn more about the musical side of things - even if they don't come away Beethoven it could still offer them a valuable insight into metre, chord progressions and musical structures and how to tie them together with lyrics. Could also be something in here for self-taught musicians too who might pick up some theory that helps broaden or indeed refine their craft. I always believe you can never 'know' or 'learn' too much and that even the smallest nugget extractable from such courses are worth it

[Neil C]

Can't see any catch here. Says its free and I can't see how it couldn't add to ones armoury?
and the discipline of 3 hours a week forcing you to start and complete songs will help, unless you're an old dog...
 
Neil
 

[seriousfun]

I think my initial reaction was wrong. It was based on a deep cinicysm of internet music adds that appear here and elswhere. After clicking the link to see what it was actually about I think is most likely some good stuff to be discussed in the course. As Neil says, no fish hooks so what is there to loose.

I have done a couple of Pat Patersons courses in the past and they were excellent, these guys look to have all together sothis may be worth a go as well.

[Sing4me88]

I have done a couple of Pat Patersons courses in the past and they were excellent, these guys look to have all together sothis may be worth a go as well.

Hi Alan, were these Pat Patterson courses free and were they on-line or in person? I'm slowly trying to ease myself a little into the musical end of things in order to offer more in collabs (I'll hardly pen a Grammy winning melody but anything that tops simple lyrics and I 'can I have a song that sounds like X by Y' is an improvement!) so I'm looking to explore all accessible resources - esp ones that have the flexibility to work away at as and when free time arises. I know I don't half ask for much

[seriousfun]

They were free courses and are hosted regularly at coursera.org and hosted by the Berklee College of Music. Pat also has a couple of great books on lyric writting as well but you gotta buy these. Recommended reading in my opinion.

[Boydie]

@ Sing4me88

Go and buy Jason Blume's 6 steps:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Six-Steps-Songwriting-Success-Comprehensive/dp/0823084779/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1436001593&sr=8-1&keywords=Jason+Blume

If you already have it - read it again  

Your best bet for learning music "theory" is to pay for a local teacher to teach you

All good teachers will be able to adapt to what you want to learn

I would suggest picking an instrument (I would recommend keyboard or guitar) and call a few local teachers saying you want to learn - not to master the instrument but to be able to write songs

I think this would be your best investment - online courses are great but there is NOTHING that will replicate the pressure of knowing your next lesson is in a few days and you haven't practiced enough!

In the time you have been talking about wanting to learn an instrument / music theory you would have had it nailed by now if you had lessons (IMHO - a little harsh but it is a friendly cyber kick up the a$$ directed at everyone that says they don't know how to play an instrument, or don't know any music theory, but want to write songs  )

Lessons aren't cheap but well worth the investment - especially if you dream of a career in songwriting!

[tone]

I've heard it said that 6 steps is the best songwriting book out there. I really must get around to buying it someday (unless someone wants to lend me their copy :p ) I was planning to read it as research for my still-unfinished songwriting book! But actually, it would probably just be a damn good read, and just because I've been writing songs for over 20 years doesn't mean there are things I can and still should learn.

Agree with lessons for theory. But also, don't underestimate the power of learning straight from the songs of the masters. You might not pick up the fancy jargon or know what a deceptive cadence is, but you might end up knowing what it sounds like and how to use it - which is just as good.

But I think it's worth pointing out that if you're interested in theory, the kind of songwriting masters you should focus on are the Paul McCartneys, Paul Simons, Burt Bacharachs of this world, not the 3 chord trick masters like Bob Dylan (ok I'm sure he uses more than 3 chords in some songs, but you get my drift).

Lessons aren't cheap as Boydie says, but I do think they're the best use of your money if you want to progress quickly. Finding a good and compatible teacher is also very important, so choose carefully!

[Sing4me88]

Hey Boydie and Tone thanks for your advice. I may well look into taking music lessons. The main problem is that I prefer an on-line theory style course that you are able to work at 'as and when' there's spare time as work gets quite hectic and there's a million other commitments so being able to commit to a lesson at a given time each week is more difficult. With an on-line resource if I've an unexpected hour free some evening/night I can work away or when travelling etc I can work on it too - more conducive to the yuppy lifestyle Either way I'm defo going to source out that book Boydie has mentioned and trawl through it.

I did enjoy messing about with keyboard and trying to learn through trial and error practice I will admit. One thing I have found is that when taking a theory approach a good vocal melody topline - I use keyboard when experimenting due to lack of vocal range/ability/talent - is more mechanical and difficult to get a natural organic sounding tune. Notes are perfectly measured etc whereas sometimes I feel the organic method of playing regardless of a neat adherence to note length (ie something might be a fraction longer than an 1/8 note but significantly smaller than a 1/4 note, something might be somewhere between 1/3 note and 1/2 note etc but still sound really good when combined in a melody) allows more freedom and a better melody. This is probably a rather stupid question but is it viable to topline this organic way (while still relying on some basic theory re chord  progressions, matching chord melody notes, 4/4 time ) rather than an overly strict and neat theoretically driven approach of perfect note lengths? Do either of you guys - or any other muses on the forum for that matter - just play and record and not necessarily worry if you're not sticking to these note values religiously?

[tone]

If I were to transcribe my vocal melodies into sheet music, they would by necessity be 'dumbed down'- by which I mean roughly approximated into half, quarter, eighth, triplet and dotted notes for ease of reading. But the reality is that (my) vocal phrasing is far more complex than that. But notating it exactly as sung would be an extremely tedious exercise in counting notes and rests that would be pretty meaningless to another singer.

So if you're planning on notating a melody for a singer, here's what I'd do. Write it in whole, half, eighth, and dotted notes (16ths if needed), but also make an audio file of how you imagine the interpretation of the melody to be. Every singer has his or her own quirks which inevitably find their way into a performance, and by rights belong there too. Take away too much of a singers personality and you end up with a rigid, lifeless performance.

When you're actually writing the melody, the last thing I would advise having in your mind would be sticking to any idea of note values. That's something to work out later.

One last word: learning theory is great, but it's 100% better when learned in conjunction with an instrument. Theory without practise is, well, just theory!

[Boydie]

The main problem is that I prefer an on-line theory style course that you are able to work at 'as and when' there's spare time as work gets quite hectic and there's a million other commitments so being able to commit to a lesson at a given time each week is more difficult.

I do appreciate that - but this is also the main advantage of booking a lesson - it commits you to learning

The downside of the "flexible" approach is that you can always "do it tomorrow"

I am half joking and playing devils advocate a bit 


Please don't fall in to the trap of thinking that learning theory will somehow stifle creativity etc.

Even when you know music theory it is still possible to just "noodle" and find topline melodies

Music theory can save time when looking for the right accompaniment and harmonies


What you are referring to with different note lengths and imperfections in timing is "groove" or "swing" and these are essential to get the right "feel" for your songs

[Wicked Deeds]

I'd say that music theory, songwriting books and courses can help to improve your songwriting skills but would also add that becoming a competent songwriter, is about immersing yourself in music. Several years before I reached the age of fifteen/sixteen. (I'm now 48) I listened to as much music as I possibly could - I lived music more than anything. I immersed myself in a colourful world of musicians and writers. I repeatedly  listened to my early influences : especially Paul Simon, Buddy Holly and The Beatles. I admired their skilful musical and writing ability - analysed their magical lyrics and dreamt of being able to do the same. It doesn't matter if success has been achieved or not but I believe that when we do this, we learn so much about songwriting.  Eventually, we're able to communicate our writing ideas when we learn how to play a musical instrument. During the early years, we're also learning the skills of production though it may take some time before we can express these ideas after obtaining greater musical skill.  Some years ago, I studied music theory and songwriting but then let my knowledge slip as my life became increasingly busy.  The point is, those early years - the time that I spent immersed in music before addressing musical theory, reading extensively about songwriting and learning to produce, we're for me the most important. Despite forgetting theory that I once learned (note to myself to brush up on these skills) I haven't forgotten how to write - it's instinctive and I can only say that this must be due to those early years that I passionately immersed myself in music. I hope this rings true with forum members. It was at least my journey!

Paul

[Alan Starkie]

Your best bet for learning music "theory" is to pay for a local teacher to teach you

All good teachers will be able to adapt to what you want to learn

I would suggest picking an instrument (I would recommend keyboard or guitar) and call a few local teachers saying you want to learn - not to master the instrument but to be able to write songs

I think this would be your best investment - online courses are great but there is NOTHING that will replicate the pressure of knowing your next lesson is in a few days and you haven't practiced enough!

In the time you have been talking about wanting to learn an instrument / music theory you would have had it nailed by now if you had lessons (IMHO - a little harsh but it is a friendly cyber kick up the a$$ directed at everyone that says they don't know how to play an instrument, or don't know any music theory, but want to write songs  )

Lessons aren't cheap but well worth the investment - especially if you dream of a career in songwriting!

I soooo wish you all lived local to me.

It's a seasonal problem for guitar/music/theory/composition teachers that summer always sees a drop in business.

I'd even give you your first lesson free too.

JUST PERSEVERE! You'll do it.