Important Question on Copyright

  • 6 Replies
  • 4360 Views

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Dogmax

  • *
  • Guest
« on: November 12, 2014, 08:56:45 PM »
Hi All

Got a question on copyright that thanks to hardtwistmusic post on a song that Jane99 and myself collaborate on which i posted on Feedback on Finished songs section call "Slowly Dying (Please Don't Leave)"

There is a lyric line in our song that goes "Crazy how falling feels like flying for a while at least" now on the link that hardtwistmusic posted to let us know and here's the link 
  the song is call "Fallin' & Flyin" and in it is the lyric line "Funny how falling feels like flying, for a little while" which is the chorus.

The question is do we have a copyright problem.



S.T.C

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 2633
  • American Cars........out now
    • http://oldsongsnew.com/
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2014, 11:24:32 PM »
Maybe ,its a hook , and it stands out....but do you think they will ever hear it? and if they ever did and caused a fuss...would be great publicity/ ;)

Dogmax

  • *
  • Guest
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2014, 07:39:41 AM »
Maybe ,its a hook , and it stands out....but do you think they will ever hear it? and if they ever did and caused a fuss...would be great publicity/ ;)

Yeah you could be right but then i could end up in prison sharing a cell with a 20st tattoo guy who keeps insisting i sing him "Back Inside Again"  every night   ;D   ;D

S.T.C

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 2633
  • American Cars........out now
    • http://oldsongsnew.com/
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2014, 11:06:06 AM »
I'm sure mr Bridges would be a perfect gentlemen and just ask you to not use their line... :)

Dogmax

  • *
  • Guest
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2014, 09:36:16 PM »
and just ask you to not use their line... :)

Yes as soon as i read Verion post and check out the lyrics to that song and found out that their lyric line is use twice in the chorus i began thinking it would be very foolish to use that line but still i thought it would be best to ask the question, i never came across this before so searching the web for information on whether you can use a lyric line from another song i found this, now i know this is USA copyright law but i would say the answer applies to other countries as well.

(Do I need permission to use song lyrics? Whom should I contact and how do I request permission?

Any use of copyrighted song lyrics beyond one line requires permission from the music publisher)

Here the link to the page.

http://www.iuniverse.com/ExpertAdvice/PublishingLaw/FAQ.aspx

Best to change that line but i have to admit, interesting.

beckylucythomas

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1109
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2014, 09:56:03 AM »
Dogmax, I'd be careful relying on the advice in that link if I were you. I think the advice is aimed at authors of books and articles etc, rather than songwriters, so quite a lot of it is focussed on the "fair use" defence in the context of quoting someone else's material in your book/article. I don't think that defence would work where you're using another song's lyrics in your song, because you're not doing it for the purpose of criticism / comment / scholarship / news reporting, or even acknowledging the source.

I did a little googling... The singer/songwriter Tom McRae has a song "Walking 2 Hawaii" from a 2003 album which starts with the lyric, "Falling feels like flying until you hit the ground". The Jeff Bridges song "Fallin & Flyin" seems to have been published in 2010, so I guess either the writers/publishers of "Fallin & Flyin" got permission from Tom McRae, or they came up with their lyric without ever having heard Tom McRae's song, or they decided theirs was enough different that it wasn't an infringement.

If your lyric was written without ever having heard a previous song with that lyric then it's not a copy and so is not an infringement - Jane would own her own copyright in it. The problem is of course that the other songs are already published so it could be difficult to prove that she'd never heard them.

The safest bet would be to change the lyric enough that it is clearly not copied.

Having said that, it's only ever going to be a problem if you ever start making money from that song, because otherwise there'd be zero point in the copyright holder suing you. So if you're not expecting to make money, I probably wouldn't worry all that much about someone suing the pants off you!

It's then more of a moral question of whether you are acknowledging the original author of that line or not. If your line was taken from another author's work rather than being written as an original idea by Jane then the original author has a moral right to be identified. If you think about it from the other side, if you ever saw that someone else had used your lyric without your permission and without acknowledging you, knowing that they'd seen your lyric first, you'd rightfully be miffed (even if you probably wouldn't be considering a lawsuit!)

But like I said, if Jane wrote the lyric without having heard it somewhere else, then it's hers and she doesn't have a moral obligation to acknowledge anyone. Then it'd only be if you start making money that you'd need to start worrying about protecting yourselves from the possibility of being sued by someone who thinks they might be able to claim an infringement.

Dogmax

  • *
  • Guest
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2014, 07:38:57 PM »
Agree with everything you say Becky and thanks for the info on that song "Walking 2 Hawaii" checked it out same Publishers "Sony/ATV Music Publishing"

Will do a new recording hopefully tomorrow but without that line but i will say it was that line and i think two other lines of Jane lyrics that first got me interested in going with an idea i had which im glad i did, it really is a great lyric line far better than the one in the other songs but for the moment its best not to use it, I've been in touch with Jane to see if she has any ideas but i haven't heard from her yet but i have a few ideas myself so will work on them for the time been, we're not going to delete this song as it is we have it register with copyright house and Jane has a copy of it, she owns the lyrics and i own the melody but at the moment its best to keep it private on soundcloud but thanks to your post im beginning to think of ways that this might work in our favour, same publishing firm might have an opportunity there but at the moment its just an idea.

Yeah you're right about that link one thing i found out from a while back is there seem to be to many difference of opinion on the fine print of copyright like on another site it said no more than two lines who do you believe, maybe that's why some cases end up in court, its great to have copyright protection on your work as it give you comfort of mind but my advice to anyone is when someone informs you of possible copyright infringement don't act foolish because as far as im concern all work has potential, you could end up in a copyright mine field, Thanks again Verion and Becky if you or anyone else has any more advice on this please post

Thanks Becky nee caco, love your new name sounds real COOLLLL   8)