What now?

  • 17 Replies
  • 6339 Views

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Jamie

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3144
« on: September 09, 2013, 02:58:51 PM »
Hi all, i love music and have played in bands but I always wanted to try to write and record my own stuff.I got my studio set up jan this year. My initial objectives were to suck it and see learn how to do it and listen for my own amusement. Ive  posted some songs on this site and I'm starting to think what next?
      I have got enough material to put together and album,but how do you do this? Or are there alternative options for getting my songs 'out there'? I'm sure most of you have gone through this thought process, but what have you done?

Cheers

Jamie ;D

Boydie

  • *
  • Administrator
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3977
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2013, 07:03:48 PM »
The first thing you need to decide is WHAT do you want from music

Do you want to be a performing artist - ie performing your own songs and being "discovered"

OR

Do you want to write songs for other people to perform

(these are the 2 VERY broad options that I think face you)


Performing Artist

You are looking to be signed by a record label, who will give you an "advance" to record your album and support your marketing. When you have sold lots (and lots and lots) of records you will have paid back your advance and will start making some money yourself! (after everyone has taken their cut - manager, agents etc.)

Unfortunately it doesn't really work like this any more. Labels are getting much more risk averse so will only take a punt on an artist which virtually guarantees them some success (or rather £$£$£$£$)

So to go down this route you essentially need to do the work of a label yourself - ie build a following, get gigs, get exposure, release an album, get known on social media etc. etc. etc.

You will need to pitch yourself AND your songs to A&R people at labels

The unfortunate truth is that "looks" and image are as important (or actually more important) than your songs/talent


Writing For Others

In this scenario you are looking for a Publisher to take on your song and then for them to pitch it to artists, labels etc. on your behalf

Getting publishers to listen to your songs is as difficult as getting to A&R people and there are lots of companies out there willing to charge you for the privilege - some have less scruples than others!

A good place to start looking is TAXI who have some very good guides and resources - although I would suggest that you don't spend a penny until you have a good collection of "hit potential" songs or you will waste an awful lot of money!!


In either scenario the songs you pitch MUST be very high quality both in terms of the song itself and the production
To check out my music please visit:

http://soundcloud.com/boydiemusic

Twitter: https://twitter.com/BoydieMusic

Jamie

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3144
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2013, 07:32:26 PM »
Hi Boydie,thanks for the feedback. Your comments sound entirely logical. I think my issue will be that the material I have been writing is not 'chart hit' material,as the music I enjoy is more rock orientated. Also I am not of the tender age to put a band together and try to build a reputation .

So I'm caught between my music needing to be performed which I won't be doing and the commercialism of the material I'm writing.Mmmmm. Tricky ;D

I guess the alternative is to try to write songs that are commercial and then pitch them.

In the meantime I guess I continue to enjoy what I'm doing,but hone the quality of the recordings and songs and see what happens!
Thanks again Boydie.
Cheers
Jamie ;D

Yodasdad

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1044
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2013, 08:17:57 PM »
Jamie,

I think I'm in a similar boat to you

It's the age old dilemma of whether to 'sell out' as some would call it.

I too find that the stuff I write naturally and want to write is not the kind of stuff that a publisher would be interested in. I accept that some of it just isn't that good but I think I've got some potential. But there is a ton of great music out there, as this forum goes to show. Unfortunately the vast majority of it just wouldn't cut it in the eyes of a publisher

The problem is that a lot (not all) of the commercial stuff out there is mass produced dross, and that's what makes the money. It seems the only way to get real stuff out there these days is to get signed as an artist based on your commercial sounding stuff and then sneak some real music in the back door and onto albums.
Or to be so well established that the emperors new clothes syndrome comes into effect and you can pass off whatever you like.

I'm pretty confident that I could write that kind of stuff if I really tried but every time I do I get an idea for what I feel to be a much better song, one that definitely wouldn't interest a publisher and I have to pursue it.

I've got a very commercial sounding track half finished and that's the way it seems to be staying at the moment because the stuff I want to write inspires me much more.

So the question is, do I continue to be true to myself and remain in obscurity with my music heard by a handful of family and friends or do I churn out what it's been deemed the mass market want to hear and potentially one day make a career and a bit of money from it.

The other option I suppose is that I just keep creating stuff and with a bit of luck, something might appear organically that has both integrity and is a commercial sounding hit in the making.

This is a very cynical view I suppose buts it where I'm at at the moment. Maybe someone with a bit more experience can set me straight.

Yodasdad

Jamie

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3144
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2013, 09:16:26 PM »
Hi Yodasdad, you express it much more eloquently than I could,you are right that's exactly how I feel.I don't want to fall into sounding overly confident,but in the end if you don't believe in your own stuff,then why bother. Interested to see if we get more feed on this.

Cheers

Jamie ;D

May the fourth be with you ;D

I played a gig with my band on the 4th of may this year and we played the star wars theme to,introduce us,puerile I know but hey......... ;D

seriousfun

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1681
    • Allan Kilgour - Original Compositions
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2013, 09:23:01 PM »
I write purely for my own enjoyment. I have no illusions of grandeur I know that what I write and produce is not of the genre nor the standard that would ever interest another artist. I also recognise that my talent is relatively low so why do I go on???

I love it.

Jess

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1329
  • Disney Princess in the making
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2013, 10:07:27 PM »
I think (if anyone cares) that you should make music that you enjoy and not feel pressured into another market because you think it'll make you more money- hey Psy released a song in KOREAN and it got to number 1 in the charts with over 1 BILLION views on YouTube, therefore anything is possible :)
I also recognise that my talent is relatively low so why do I go on???
If your talent is relatively low then what does that make the rest of us?! If you need another reason to keep making music then make it to buy another snazzy hat like the one in your live stream ;D :D
"When writing a song, if your afraid to suck, you'll never write a note" -Jeff Boyle

Yodasdad

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1044
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2013, 10:28:55 PM »
Interestingly Jamie, May the fourth is my sons birthday!

My user name just popped into my head, I'm not really a particular Star Wars nut.

But now I think about it, maybe I really am the dad of Yoda.

Spooky...

Yodasdad

Onelabel

  • *
  • Busker
  • *
  • Posts: 69
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2013, 04:18:48 PM »
Seriously great advice guys - I'm reading though this thread agreeing with every point made. You'd do well to stick this near the top as its a very useful read.

The only thing I'd add is that my experience recently on the publishing side is that the medium to large publishers in both London and Nashville are looking for strong CV's with some clear success points (really catch22 for new writers I know) AND some demonstrable ability to market your songs yourself (ie your network) - which does make you wonder what these guys do for their 50%  :D

I cannot understate how utterly difficult it is right now for new artists and/or writers to break through right now. Not impossible but damn, damn hard!

seriousfun

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1681
    • Allan Kilgour - Original Compositions
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2013, 10:32:14 PM »
The unfortunate truth is that "looks" and image are as important (or actually more important) than your songs/talent




Whoopsie, I missed this bit first time round. Looks like I'll have to swap my hat for a balaclava

S.T.C

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 2633
  • American Cars........out now
    • http://oldsongsnew.com/
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2013, 10:48:42 PM »
The unfortunate truth is that "looks" and image are as important (or actually more important) than your songs/talent




Whoopsie, I missed this bit first time round. Looks like I'll have to swap my hat for a balaclava

 :D

Onelabel

  • *
  • Busker
  • *
  • Posts: 69
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2013, 01:00:00 PM »
I must have missed this too as the labels I'm regularly speaking with do not see looks as anywhere near the most imporant thing - although clearly you need to have an 'image' that they get/understand.

I could throw a stick and hit half a dozen great looking artists with great self-penned songs. These are really talented young artists who have already had National airplay, played the big summer festivals etc. but can't get the labels to invest as they just don't have a big enough following. For majors to commit it needs to be an absolute 'no brainer' which means 'almost zero risk' - ie guaranteed sales OR great connections.

Bottom line is you can be a 2ft midget with green hair and they will be all over you if you've got 50,000 fans already buying your (self-released) tracks.

Talent is still seen as a prerequisite or else there's the concern that there won't be a longer term revenue stream.

Jess

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 1329
  • Disney Princess in the making
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2013, 06:29:03 PM »
Bottom line is you can be a 2ft midget with green hair and they will be all over you if you've got 50,000 fans already buying your (self-released) tracks..
...I think you've just described Allan ;D ;D ;D
(That's revenge... ;))
"When writing a song, if your afraid to suck, you'll never write a note" -Jeff Boyle

hardtwistmusic

  • *
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3037
  • Central Oregon Sunset
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2013, 07:44:35 PM »
Jamie,

I think I'm in a similar boat to you

It's the age old dilemma of whether to 'sell out' as some would call it.

Yodasdad

:O)     ..  Heck, I'd "sell out" in a New York Minute if I only knew HOW.   

If I want to "sell out" whose buying, and how do I find them?  :O)
www.reverbnation.com/hardtwistmusicsongwriter

Verlon Gates  -  60 plus years old.

Boydie

  • *
  • Administrator
  • Stadium Tour
  • *****
  • Posts: 3977
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2013, 08:40:11 AM »
Just to clarify my original comment about look and image...

I am not just saying you need to look like a model to be an "artist"

I am saying that you need to have an "image" that differentiates you from the "normal" people

This is not just a music industry thing - an artist is simply a product that a record label wants to "sell" so all of the standard marketing models apply

Think of an artist's image as "product packaging aimed at the target market" and you will get where I am coming from

Eg Smarties are aimed at kids so have bright colourful packaging (and lids that could choke an elephant - or am I showing my age here)

It is the same with artists - if you are being aimed at kids you have to be pretty in a very specific way (think Disney: highschool musical, that Bieber bloke etc.)

The problems come when the artists start growing up and want to change their image - eg Bieber and that  Miley Montanna girl

It is like suddenly trying to give Smarties an edgier and and aiming them at adults ( and yes some adults like smarties but some like Bkeber et all)

A rock artist tends to have a certain image etc. etc. - Neville from accounts is unlikely to picked up by a label as an artist even if he has great songs although a publisher might

 Would Neville have a big following on YouTube etc. without the image to match? I doubt it

The exceptions are the TV talent shows - Paul Potts, Susan Boyle but I would still argue the marketing machine and the "back story" (often created by the show with the emotional being music) are all part of the marketing

It is possible to re-brand successfully - eg Lucozade from pseudo medicine to a funky sports/energy drink (in pre-redbull days of course) and Kylie, Madonna and Justin Timberlake are the pop successes for changing image/target market

Just some more food for thought
« Last Edit: September 12, 2013, 08:44:04 AM by Boydie »
To check out my music please visit:

http://soundcloud.com/boydiemusic

Twitter: https://twitter.com/BoydieMusic