Acoustic guitar

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Kafla

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« on: April 13, 2013, 09:05:52 AM »
Right one for the techies  ;D

Best practices for getting an acoustic guitar to sit nicely in the mix.

in terms of effects ( reverb etc) EQ ing , recording - DI or mic, panning

Thanks in advance  :)

Boydie

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« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2013, 10:03:22 AM »
See my thread on "fake stereo mic'd" guitar, which contains 2 different approaches for creating a big stereo sound for acoustic guitar

This is obviously assuming you have a good recording

I would say always Mic the guitar - a good vocal mic will be perfect for this, especially a large diaphargm

Mic placement is a whole dark art and you essentially need to experiment with different placements for your guitar

A good starting point is to site the mike around the soundhole but point it towards the 12th fret of the guitar - around 10 inches away from the body of the guitar - although also experiment with distances

If using more than 1 mic (for stereo or mics at different distances to capture different sounds) be aware of "phasing" issues where the soundwaves hit the mics at different times (potentially cancelling (or partially cancelling) each other out)

You can correct this in the DAW by nudging the audio tracks to line up better

If you have a DI option I would always record this as well to give options in the mix - my best sounds are usually my DI + Mic mixed together

A bit of compression can be nice to even things out but it will also increase background noise (eg finger noise) if you up the make up gain so make sure you get the results you want

Eq - I would roll of the boominess on the bottom but the rest is to taste depending on the mix - do you want a "woody" tone or a more high end "poppy/strummy" tone

Don't forget that an acoustic tone that sounds great on its own may not sit in the mix

Often my acoustic sounds "thin" on its own but works in the mix

Reverb - again it depends on the mix, I would be tempted to approach this in exactly the same way you approach your vocals (which you clearly have an ear for)

Often, if you can actually "hear" the reverb it is too much!

Finally, and most importantly, wait for JAMES NIGHTHAWK and RAMSY to chime in! They know a thing or 2 about how to record and process an acoustic guitar!!!!
To check out my music please visit:

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James Nighthawk

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« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2013, 11:26:30 AM »
...DI or mic...


Do you even need to ask what I think about this one?! LOL

This is a simple question with a huge answer. So, what exactly are you after tone wise? Give me song well known examples of acoustic guitar sounds you love.

I personally adore a hi-fi, full spectrum acoustic sound. But the problem with this is it takes up so much of the mix that other instruments have to play second fiddle to it. Ramshackles has mentioned before that when mixing acoustic into a full mix you often have to sacrifice tone to allow other sounds to breathe, so many acoustic guitar sounds you hear in mixes would sound dull/neutered by themselves.

My general starting point for multi tracking:
Dead room. Mic'ed in stereo. Little to no reverb often works in a mix, unless stylistic (think fleet foxes reverb). Playing style needs considering. Dynamics are a major point (do you want one level strumming or dynamic barely compressed finger picking a la Nick Drake?)

Not a simple question this at all, so throw some specifics our way :)
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Kafla

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« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2013, 01:27:21 PM »
Cheers guys

I find it hard sometimes to get a guitar to sit in the mix - sometimes it sounds separate from the other tracks

I appreciate all your good advice  ;D

Ramshackles

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« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2013, 07:30:17 PM »
First off, use a mic (or two) always, as JN said.

BUT..if you want your guitar to 'cut through' a mix a bit more, it can sometimes help to mix in a little of the DI signal.

JN has mentioned that it depends a hell of a lot on the type of tone/music you are doing and the density of the mix. I'll back him up on that.
He likes a dead sound and that comes across in his songs, where the guitar sounds up close and personal.
I like a different type of sound. The room you record in plays a HUGE role in recording an acoustic, even when you are after a dead sound.

I'm recording in a local church next week, specifically to do acoustic guitars for an EP. If you are after a rich, reverby sound you could try this. The 'alternative' religions (methodist, baptist etc) are often quite receptive to local arts (I'm not paying anything to use the church for a few hours) and often have slightly more modern churches with a smoother, less 'drowning' reverb than the big old stone ones...

You can construct moveable acoustic panels quite easily to help you deaden a room. I just built 6 and was going to post a little tutorial on here. Depending on construction they can be effective down to about 80-100hz

As is probably obvious, my philosophy is 'try to get it as close as possible at the source'. The better you get the actual recording, the easier mixing will be. You can't polish a...

Mic placement is crucial.

What mic's do you have available? Perhaps we can give tips on using these.

Neil C

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« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2013, 04:27:37 PM »
Andy, in addition to the above I often find taking some lows out and a little compression helps make them sit better.
:)
Neil
songwriter of no repute..

Stephen Palmer

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« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2013, 09:58:52 AM »
A small amount of compression is often useful, but it does need to be small...

Neil C

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« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2013, 01:03:49 PM »
Another way to get a full sound with a single mic for those who have an electro-acoustic is to also DI the guitar. You've then got a pair of different sounding recordings to apply various effects to. I'll try to put something at the weekend to illustrate if I remember..
:)
Neil
 
songwriter of no repute..

Alan Starkie

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« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2013, 01:51:22 PM »
Easy compression with slow attack for strumming. Slightly more compression with faster attack for pick work. And obviously, ALWAYS put new strings on for the final tracking of your acoustics.

Neil C

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« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2013, 11:00:44 AM »
Here's an example of the single acoustic ( a cheap Seagull ) with mic and DI. A bit of eq, compression, reverb ( I cheated and used EZmix ) and fake stereo ( Hass ). What's good is you can play with balance, stereo image etc.
http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/feedback-on-works-in-progress/mexico/
:)
Neil
songwriter of no repute..