[Alan Starkie]

Me personally? Do you like it or not.... simple. That's what I need to know. I'm trying to write a brilliant hit record Tone like every other Joe out there. A well trod path....

[S.T.C]

Me personally? Do you like it or not.... simple. That's what I need to know. I'm trying to write a brilliant hit record Tone like every other Joe out there. A well trod path....

Ah , a brilliant hit record...

There's two songs i listen too ,again and again on The youtube..

Bee Gees ...Massachusetts  and mama`s/Papa`s....California dreaming...i hope some of the magic will rub off...the lightening in the bottle....

There's other songs that i could also mention , but these two....just encapsulate, what i want to achieve .......keep writing.

[Schavuitje]

Interesting topic this.
I guess I don't agree with the "not my cup of tea" comment because it is something
I would say myself. I review from a personal point of view, of course, how could I review from any other?
I like music from pretty much most genre's from country to pop, from jazz to rock, from classical to blues and I know what sounds good to me in each and all of those categories.
I would also say that constructive feedback need not also automatically equal - possitive - feedback.
If people only want to give possitive feedback, then the person who wrote the song thinks that everyone loves it and all is good. The writer has no idea that there may be a percentage of people out there who dislike it for whatever reason. It's up to the writer how much he wants to take on board any negative critisism's. Some he/she may think fair, some not.
If everyone said it's good but not my cup of tea, you would have a really good idea of how many peoples cup of tea it really is.
Now I need a cup of tea 

[Kafla]

Interesting topic this.
I guess I don't agree with the "not my cup of tea" comment because it is something
I would say myself. I review from a personal point of view, of course, how could I review from any other?
I like music from pretty much most genre's from country to pop, from jazz to rock, from classical to blues and I know what sounds good to me in each and all of those categories.
I would also say that constructive feedback need not also automatically equal - possitive - feedback.
If people only want to give possitive feedback, then the person who wrote the song thinks that everyone loves it and all is good. The writer has no idea that there may be a percentage of people out there who dislike it for whatever reason. It's up to the writer how much he wants to take on board any negative critisism's. Some he/she may think fair, some not.
If everyone said it's good but not my cup of tea, you would have a really good idea of how many peoples cup of tea it really is.
Now I need a cup of tea 

 

You know Lee what you have described here makes perfect sense

It's more the 'its good but it's not my cup of tea' and the the reviewer doesn't elaborate on why that I find pointless

Anyway I only drink coffee 

The whole hit thing is also interesting

When I heard your latest song perseverence - stronger - I immediately thought of Train

Your songs have hit potential but they sound like a band/artist who writes their own music so in a sense you would need to make it to have a hit

Now if you want to write for other people that market is Brittany , Rhianna , Little Mix , Girls Aloud etc

Now your music would probably not suit them - I am sure even pink writes all her own stuff

I know it's taking it OT but I thought about that all night and could hardly sleep 

[Boydie]

Completely agree with your last comments KAFLA and this is something I have been harking on about for a while

This is also a great example for this discussion

If I could borrow the TARDIS and go back in time to post some of the recent pop chart hit records / number ones in the UK on this forum for review before they had been released I am pretty sure they would get an absolutely slating for being corny, cliche, banal, crap lyrics, melodies "too" simple, predictable, well trodden chord sequences etc.

Writing a potential hit record is something completely different from writing a "good" song - especially as we all have a different opinion of "good"

That doesn't de-value this forum though as ANY feedback is great - but you as the writer always need to filter this feedback and see how it "fits" with your goals

[Alan Starkie]

Interesting topic this.
I guess I don't agree with the "not my cup of tea" comment because it is something
I would say myself. I review from a personal point of view, of course, how could I review from any other?
I like music from pretty much most genre's from country to pop, from jazz to rock, from classical to blues and I know what sounds good to me in each and all of those categories.
I would also say that constructive feedback need not also automatically equal - possitive - feedback.
If people only want to give possitive feedback, then the person who wrote the song thinks that everyone loves it and all is good. The writer has no idea that there may be a percentage of people out there who dislike it for whatever reason. It's up to the writer how much he wants to take on board any negative critisism's. Some he/she may think fair, some not.
If everyone said it's good but not my cup of tea, you would have a really good idea of how many peoples cup of tea it really is.
Now I need a cup of tea 

 

You know Lee what you have described here makes perfect sense

It's more the 'its good but it's not my cup of tea' and the the reviewer doesn't elaborate on why that I find pointless

Anyway I only drink coffee 

The whole hit thing is also interesting

When I heard your latest song perseverence - stronger - I immediately thought of Train

Your songs have hit potential but they sound like a band/artist who writes their own music so in a sense you would need to make it to have a hit

Now if you want to write for other people that market is Brittany , Rhianna , Little Mix , Girls Aloud etc

Now your music would probably not suit them - I am sure even pink writes all her own stuff

I know it's taking it OT but I thought about that all night and could hardly sleep 

Well one thing's for sure - I'm not on the cards for a hit!

Interesting though that two of the four artists you mentioned are now relative has-beens...

Train are quite old too come to think of it. I'm looking to get my songs cut by ANY recording artist TBH. I'm not fussy, you can't be. All I can do is present my music in the most professional way I can and hopefully one will be picked up at some point.

[Schavuitje]

You have that right for sure. All you can do is get it out to publishers and such like and hope
that someone can see a match... and then hope it does well.
You have a good point too Boydie about people who are trying to write hits following a different path to those who are out to write good creative music. I would agree that if you had done that thing with the hits before they were hits, many of the songs would have gotten slated for being boring, creativless and unoriginal. Although I am one of those who will comment on boring, done a million times chord choices, I have realised that it is not the chords themselves that bothers me, but the way in which they are presented. Presented in the same tired old way with no hint of anything interesting being done with them and it immediately falls flat on its face for me. However those same tired, boring chords CAN make a good song IF you do something more than just strum them AGAIN on an accoustic. Many pop songs do this of course, playing with rythmns, adding counterpoint and interesting synth riffs...
I certainly don't think that all pop is rubbish, far from, there's plenty interesting enough pop songs out there.
Even when the writer has settled on the over used chords and the unoriginal melodies, it has to be done well, extremely well to stand up against what are current hits. Keeping up with the latest trends in synths is hard enough.
So writing 'now' sounding hit type records is more difficult than you think, even though you barely have to think about chord choices, so unless you really get it right, it will sound like those same old chords being forced out in that same old way. Boring and cliched.
That's why for me, some of the songs on here that are aiming for exactly that, sound old tired and cliched and not like something I can imagine being a hit.
So it Isn't really the chords, although sometimes I wonder if people have any imagination at all with some things that I hear, but more what you do with them. For me anyway 

[Alan Starkie]

You've just repeated everything you said to me regarding 'Next To Me'. Just tell me again directly man. I can take it...

[Boydie]

I agree SCHAV - and this is why I see the "production and arrangement" as a key part of the songwriting process, and is why it is so important to get it all in there for the demo


If SCHAV has repeated what he said in one of your reviews surely he did tell you directly?

[Alan Starkie]

Yes he did the first time. I was asking to be told directly AGAIN and indeed anytime that someone makes a direct reference to me (veiled or not).

[Boydie]

Ah, I see

To be fair I don't think SCHAV's comments above were directly aimed at you personally

I am sure he will clarify but I think he was making a general statement about those trying to write commercial pop tunes (myself included)

The tricky balance is trying to write something "different" enough to be noticed but familiar enough for an a&r person to recognize as a hit (as they are often not musicians or songwriters and wouldn't appreciate anything "clever")

The mantra is often: "different, but not too different", which is an incredibly difficult middle ground to hit!

[Schavuitje]

You need to chill out mate.
What I wrote in this topic was relevent to this topic and not directed at you personally.
It was directed at anyone and everyone.
I did write something very simillar to one of the songs you posted because that is what I thought of it, but that doesn't mean that because I have said something simillar that is relevant to the topic, that is a veiled blow. People know me on here. I don't do 'veiled blows'. I am always honest and straight forward whether you agree or like it or not.
You have neglected to mention how much I liked the 2nd song you posted.
I react to each song on its own merit. And if I think it is shit, I will tell you because that is my opinion.
I will tell you why I think it is shit and then it is up to you to either agree or not.
So to recap. Yes, I thought the first one was shit, and I told you that in your song thread. No, what I wrote in this thread wasn't directed at you but at all songs presented for review.
You need to realize that although you are good at what you do, that you are not infallable and sometimes people might actually not like something you have done, and they may even say so and give their reasons why.
You need to just take that on the chin as one of MANY opinions and chill the f*ck out  

[flossie]

Right.

Perseverence I didn't see Schauv's comment as a veiled comment at all but if he has said that to you in another thread I can see why you would think that.

Schauv is indeed well know for his forthright (see how I'm being diplomatic!) opinions but in this instance I think saying a song is shit is unnecessary and far toooo rude forthright.  However he is one of my fave's!!!

There are a good few people trying to write commercial songs here but probably more who write without a publishing deal in mind. There is certainly more scope for creativity when songwriters do this I think. I am now writing for commercial opportunities but sometimes can't help but slip into my 'old ways'!

There is always much to learn off of other people and I am keen to receive all critique from all sorts of people, not just a that's good that's bad etc.  That is really important to me personally. It can be frustrating when you have an agenda and you just want to know the 'truth' but I think the kind of reviews you are after will only be forthcoming from publishers who know exactly what they are after and hear lots of writers of that type of music all the time.

Can we all just be nice to one another please. 

Thanks
 

[Alan Starkie]

You need to chill out mate.
What I wrote in this topic was relevent to this topic and not directed at you personally.
It was directed at anyone and everyone.
I did write something very simillar to one of the songs you posted because that is what I thought of it, but that doesn't mean that because I have said something simillar that is relevant to the topic, that is a veiled blow. People know me on here. I don't do 'veiled blows'. I am always honest and straight forward whether you agree or like it or not.
You have neglected to mention how much I liked the 2nd song you posted.
I react to each song on its own merit. And if I think it is shit, I will tell you because that is my opinion.
I will tell you why I think it is shit and then it is up to you to either agree or not.
So to recap. Yes, I thought the first one was shit, and I told you that in your song thread. No, what I wrote in this thread wasn't directed at you but at all songs presented for review.
You need to realize that although you are good at what you do, that you are not infallable and sometimes people might actually not like something you have done, and they may even say so and give their reasons why.
You need to just take that on the chin as one of MANY opinions and chill the f*ck out 

You're way too aggressive my friend. And please don't say it's because you care so much. You are just too aggressive. Do you handle daily life in this way?

I'm not the one who needs to chill.

[tone]

and breathe.......



Ahhhh



Nice isn't it?


To be calm....

Ok, some misunderstandings abounding here and some poor communication. Can we go back to nice friendly forum now please.