[habiTat]

We all work really hard on our music, and the quality and talent aren't lacking. The main issue seems to be, getting heard. The Pawprint album hit rate has tailed off (no pun intended) massively already with only a handful of listens/downloads in the past few weeks. Given the relatively good exposure, charity nature and  cross networking it got, it's quite disappointing. What hope is there for one of us on our own, if twelve of us, plus others can't gather a steady following?

To me it seems we only need one success to break through, Gangnam style, One pound fish, anything really, be it silly, funny or just completely different.

How do we cut through all the white noise and actually get noticed?

I don't particularly want fame but the hope of some future fortune would be nice 

I mainly write music because I love doing it but it's nice to always think, "one day, maybe"

Or will we all still be here, doing the same thing, getting 25 listens to a song (from each other), in 20 years time?

Anyone got any ideas?

[Dutchbeat]

Ha Habi,

it good to have dreams...you wonder will we still be here in 20 years time. I hope i will be  . In fact i have been making songs for something like 35 years already, and i am fine with just making songs, and extremely happy with the 25 views / listens via the forum, because before i joined this forum i only had two or three people listening to it  , and even that kept me going 

so, this will do for me  , but i agree, still i also want to make something many people want to hear, but that is enough to make writing a new song a new challenge everytime, and the process of making it seems rewarding enough. I am suprised that not everybody is into this hobby, to be honest, because it is so much fun to do. Some people go running everyday (i am much too lazy for that) or go to football matches, or collect things, that all seems so incredibly boring to me compared to trying to make again another song 

[S.T.C]

20 years time hope not....part of the problem now is there's too much music,,too easily available  , and i think theres a lot of apathy about....so stuffs got to be really stand out to have any chance of succes.

Theres other things like fashion,style,,image..

But being a one hit wonder ..is the best bet..

[Boydie]

Hmmm, this is an interesting one

I am afraid to say it here - but if you want to write to be noticed (published or have your own hit) IMHO you do need to "play by the rules" and write to the recognised structures, formats, themes etc. to be "commercially viable"

However, it seems to be these types of songs that generally do not go down well on the forum - if you posted any number of the current top 40 in the forum I am pretty sure that they would get ripped apart for being "simple", cliched, predictable, obvious etc.

The Pawprint is a good example - the songs were all top notch but not very commercially focussed

Whether you like it or not - if you want to make money from having a song published you need to writing what is current, being "different, but not too different"

Then there is the production, any demos these days need to be "broadcast quality" - ie of a standard and quality to be put straight on the radio

IMHO to stand any kind of slim chance of selling a song you need to write a commercially viable "hit" with a VERY clear idea of who could record it, then record and produce the best demo you can, find a friendly PROFESSIONAL studio and producer (eg our very own Mr JAMES NIGHTHAWK) to sprinkle some magic dust on it and master it for you - this is definitely worth paying for if you believe you have a hit song

This is actually the easy bit!

You then need to get the song to the right person and at the right time - this could be via a lifetime of making contacts, using a lead/tip sheet or using a paid for pitching service (eg TAXI)

This is my own gameplan for getting a song picked up in 2013

Collabs are also worth a mention here - if you want to get a song picked up in a style you are not familiar with or you just want to work outside of your comfort zone then a collab is definitely the way to go

These are just my own personal views and opinions of course and this is definitely not the only way to skin a cat

[James Nighthawk]

Very good points from Boydie there (and thanks for the Hat tip  )

You are right. Demos need to be finished products for label attention. This I have seen first hand from speaking with label peeps coming thru my doors.

What also needs addressing is the aims.

As Boydie has mentioned before, making it as a Pop writer for established artists is very different to making it as a singer songwriter.

The route and the songs.

The stuff I post on here would not get much notice from a pop marketeer, but personally I write stuff as a singer/songwriter - an artist with a collection of work. Such things allow for a different rule set, and, equally, the route to "Breaking" is different.

I have no great desire to break and make it as a super-star-singer-songwriter. To be gigging, publishing a few albums and having a small following would be great and manageable alongside my day job running my own studio. But I am an oddity (both on here and in the world in general).

How do I intend to "break" this aim? Well I plan to self publish this year. Gig more. Sell CDs at gigs and get a kick ass website online to nab the passers by.

Should my FB likes/twitter followers go from 3 figures to 4/5, then perhaps I will approach labels. As I will have a near complete "package" for them.

It is amazing the leg work we are expected to do. Labels often want a near sure thing.

The POP world however,,, not something I have researched very far.

I hear having a great set of knockers helps.... 

[habiTat]

Don't get me wrong, I am very happy with my lot, I have enough equipment to keep me busy learning for years, I am making some great friends on here, I wouldn't want to necessarily change things, I have never played live and have no desire to. It's just nice to think that one day maybe it would be possible to strike gold with a little idea, a song or video, something which people like and share across the internet, again and again and be able to make a bit of money from it. I'm not commercially driven really at all, the music I make is whatever I feel like doing and I don't really think about how to make it mainstream or commercially viable. It's more the phenomenon of the viral success that fascinates me, something which could never have happened 15 years ago, yet now seems to be a weekly occurence. I found this list... interesting read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Internet_phenomena

[montydog]

Good points made already. I agree with songsthatcry, music has been devalued to a background wallpaper while other things are going on (TV, Console, Smartphone, Tablet etc etc). If you listen to even the better chart songs, they are pretty banal but they have an ear catching (bloody annoying most of the time) production which makes them stand out on the radio.

Personally, I think the only places where song craft still counts are modern folk and country music. These are niches  and country has a bad name in the UK which is a shame. Folk has become a bit more cool thanks to Mumford & Sons but generally the mainstream is a write off (no pun intended) as far as decent songwriting goes.

You've got to be young, beautiful and very, very lucky to "make it".

I've come very late to the whole songwriting/playing an instrument thing so it's all still a bit of a surreal experience. This forum has been absolutely vital to me so I hope it's still going in 20 years.

[Alan Starkie]

There's only one answer to this question and not many people want to hear it - To have any chance of being a successful songwriter, you need to be focused, dedicated and single-minded.

Trying half-heartedly just won't cut it. You have to be unrelenting and confident that you have something that will compete with the best.

A publisher told me recently 'no one is interested in albums anymore. The only thing anyone is looking for is hit singles. It is extremely difficult to get a song cut but a hit song with a killer hook is undeniable to both publishers and artists'.

If you can deliver that, you've got a chance. This is the reality though - you won't do it as a hobbyist. You've got to approach it as a job. Everything has to be as perfect as you can possibly make it.

[Boydie]

I couldn't agree more Perserverance

When people moan about how expensive a service like TAXI is they are clearly not bearing in mind that "in the old days" they would have had to move to LA or Nashville and spend years making contacts to stand a chance of being heard

I do still think the "hobbyist" has a shot IF they are prepared to take a considered approach and put their own ego to one side

Ie approach it like a "business" rather than just "writing from the heart" and assuming everyone will love their stuff

It is important to only write HITS to stand any chance - if you have an "album track" it is better to go down the licensing route

This also applies to the production side and having a pro "polish" a good track will increase your chances

Remember, you can't polish a turd - but you can roll it in glitter 

[Alan Starkie]

So true. Write, write, write. Spend time learning how to record in a professional way. You don't need a studio but you DO need to know how pro studios treat songs and the plugins they use. If you like 'rough and ready', that's fine. Just don't expect a music industry professional to think of it in the same way as you.

There are thousands of songwriters recording songs that are of equal quality to anything you hear on the radio. Give yourself the best chance.

[S.T.C]

Well with people like Ed Sherrin making it , theres always hope.....get a half guitar.don`t shave,have a useless stage presence and sing about lego....but loads of spotty adolescent kids think he`s deep and speaks to them..........45 yrs ago Bob Dylan did the same thing...but theres a big difference  ,the music[another post]..

Making it as an artist....is practically fantasy...having a period of success,maybe not,,even a record deal doesn`t mean youv`e made it,,and certainly not financially ! ...but it will impress your kids or your mother.

Knocking up a hit...hmmm , yes,but seems to be almost like perfecting  alchemy ,i`m basing this on the mass ranks of professional writers,,who seem to deliver only now and again,or at least to my ear...i`m not including all the songs forced into the market through advertising and tons of money...slick video,girls ,gold chains and flashy cars...

So..whats left...just rue the fact, that you never lived next door to Adele...and helped the girl with her song writing......you would possibility be quite wealthy by now..

Sorry not to add much thats positive,,unless knowing reality is  being positive

[seriousfun]

I am personally neither talented enough nor committed enough to ever 'break through'.

My focus is 100% writing and recording for personal enjoyment and hopefully through feedback such as this Forum provides, a slow and steady improvement. My strategy for being heard is to give my music away freely to however wants to hear it. I would rather have a few thousand albums out there being listened to and appreciated than just a handful that have earned me $100 in total. To achieve this I have my songs posted on a few websites and also have a site of my own. God knows how people find my site but I am now getting over 70 downloads a month from my own site and about 500 album downloads a month from jamendo. Other sites contribute a little as well but nothing like jamendo.

Some local cd give always to interested followers and that is the sum total of my strategy unless you want to count a couple of appearances each month at various open mike events and club evenings.

I'm not getting famous and I am not getting rich but it suits me just fine. I am in it for the enjoyment factor.

[Boydie]

Some interesting thoughts

I agree trying to break through as an artist is completely different from trying to make a living from selling songs so good point

It is also important to remember that we all have different goals and breaking through may mean different things to different people

I think what you are doing is great SERIOUSFUN

I would love to hear other people's goals and ambitions to better understand their writing

[man of simple pleasures]

well i want to write a number one album... haha in my dreams!

for me its purely for fun but i do have aims... write 10 good enough songs to get them fully produced and make an album.. make some cd artwork including a lyrics booklet and also to play the somgs at buskers nights!

sticking songs up on here has inspired me to keep writing and playing!

[Kafla]

Purley for enjoyment

To get one of you saying - I really enjoyed that