PAYING A COMPANY TO RECORD A DEMO

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devilsbones

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« on: August 13, 2012, 11:17:51 AM »
Just had an interesting offer. After listening to a cd of mine a company have offered to produce a better demo and to hawk it around. If it`s cut,they get some of the publishing. However I pay for the making of the demo. Any thoughts?

James Nighthawk

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« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2012, 12:24:32 PM »
Sounds iffy.

Personally I would get musicians togther yourself, and pay for the studio time yourself, ergo keeping all credits. You are paying either way, so retain the rights if I were you

My two cents :)
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devilsbones

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« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2012, 01:27:51 PM »
Cheers James

I`m thinking of doing that,should be doing that anyway,I can spare a couple of hundred every 3

months to lay down a few tracks. That`s how I have the cd,but iffy or not,man is this offer

tempting...these aren`t  back street boys. But my reckoning is if they believe they can sell your

stuff,they should pay for recording. The amount is reasonable,but I know if someone was seriously

punting you to say,Xfactor finalists or some up and comers,even a really good demo should run

into  thousands for studio time. Might be wrong though.


 



devilsbones

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« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2012, 01:31:23 PM »
Sorry,don`t know why above post is broken. It`s what I wrote,just jigged up!

Boydie

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« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2012, 03:13:33 PM »
I am sorry to say that this is a classic manipulation of your desire for success

It is not dodgy, and not necessarily immoral as they may genuinely believe they can help you

HOWEVER, this is the classic case of them looking to make cash now

It is exactly the same as the classic "model" scenario where young girls get stopped in the street by "model agencies" that tell them they are beautiful, ask if they have ever thought of becoming a model, charge them hundreds (and hundreds and hundreds) of pounds for a photoshoot, portfolio, promise of "touting" etc.

The truth is they are looking to make money from you for producing the demo - I would take the whole "hawking it around" bit with a huge pinch of salt

If they are a publisher that wants (and believes) in your song they will work with you to push it

The key question for you is to strip away the excitement and ask yourself do you really NEED a better demo

Perhaps it is worth posting the song here for review and we can give you an honest opinion on the production and commercial viability of the track - at least this would give you some feel for whether they are just flattering you to make a quick buck

Sorry if this sounds at all harsh but this does have all the hallmarks of playing on your desire for success - the flattery followed by the hint they can push the track - followed by the "and it will only cost you..."
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devilsbones

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« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2012, 04:09:44 PM »
I am sorry to say that this is a classic manipulation of your desire for success

It is not dodgy, and not necessarily immoral as they may genuinely believe they can help you

HOWEVER, this is the classic case of them looking to make cash now

It is exactly the same as the classic "model" scenario where young girls get stopped in the street by "model agencies" that tell them they are beautiful, ask if they have ever thought of becoming a model, charge them hundreds (and hundreds and hundreds) of pounds for a photoshoot, portfolio, promise of "touting" etc.

The truth is they are looking to make money from you for producing the demo - I would take the whole "hawking it around" bit with a huge pinch of salt

If they are a publisher that wants (and believes) in your song they will work with you to push it

The key question for you is to strip away the excitement and ask yourself do you really NEED a better demo
Perhaps it is worth posting the song here for review and we can give you an honest opinion on the production and commercial viability of the track - at least this would give you some feel for whether they are just flattering you to make a quick buck

Sorry if this sounds at all harsh but this does have all the hallmarks of playing on your desire for success - the flattery followed by the hint they can push the track - followed by the "and it will only cost you..."


Thanks for the comments. BIB is what I want to focus on,because there does seem to be a little industry developing (or already developed,but just transforming) that takes advantage of a desire for success,as you so eloquently put it.

Ironically since all this is happening within a week of sending the cd (I have received 2 emails from the company),that is WAY too quick--I`m lucky if I get a response to any of my 10+ emails sent out,that`s why I`ve got a uh,feeling I need to at least think before handing over cash.

The thing is,imo, one of the two songs I sent does have potential and is,though not let down by the production,it needs a more appropriate pop production,which is what this company say they can deliver. These aren`t one of those guys from some old band from the 60s promising this and that. They have good pop success. I`ll upload it as you advise,but I`m pretty certain this isn`t atrocious by any means and they`re buttering me up. I think I need a beter demo,but who doesn`t think that? They say it can`t be presented to labels and artists in its current form,which I guess can be said of any recording (mine was Pro-tools,live bass and guitar, with drum plug-ins at a professional studio)

The second thing is; in this business you need contacts,and as I say in my second post,this is no backstreet
company with a PO box and no web-page,the guy emailing me is a name,with a great track record (though the heyday of that was a while back :)). I don`t want to name names precisely because this would be a great contact,and I know he`s signed up at least at another songwriters` forum I visit (sic).

I`m going to hopefully get feedback from other companies and then use that as leverage to get this company
to forget the upfront cost coming from myself alone,and only `costs` coming when they take it from roylalties they are so confident my song can get.

I received an --I think copy and paste--email from them today advising that if I am interested they`ll drop me an email with some song-links showing their production skills.

I`m betting these are their old (ish) hits,or recent no expense spared LA productions they have some loose connection with and very different from their `demo` service recordings.

Boydie

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« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2012, 04:35:34 PM »
It is always a tricky one and you have done the right thing by keeping a cool head and posting here for advice/opinions

I would suggest posting the song here and get some independent feedback on the song and production


Then get some FIRM quotes (with no surprises that include tracking, mixing and mastering) and see if it is worth risking

I can see why you are tempted but it is definitely ringing alarm bells with me

Are they actually a publisher? - if not you are not really gaining anything as there are lots of demo services out there

If they run a mile from taking the demo costs out of future royalties then they are really just looking to produce a demo - which, to be fair, may be exactly what the track needs

We really need to hear it to get a feel
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devilsbones

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« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2012, 04:43:24 PM »
Thanks Boydie,I`m putting it in the reviews section with a link to this discussion. The company do do publishing. I should have mentioned that. I`ll be researching a `publishing development deal` they have recently set up with a songwriter (as recently as March). It`s my first time in the reviews section,if lyrics are absolutely necessarty,will put them up (I did not send in lyrics to this company). It hasn`t stopped loading so will probably do this this pm. Try soundclick/devilsbones
it may have uploaded by the time I leave this computer (1700hrs) I`ll shift it to review when I can.

Cheers.

devilsbones

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« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2012, 09:08:37 AM »
Whoops,doesn`t seem to be loading into Soundclick,will try and sort out today.

Ramshackles

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« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2012, 10:25:25 AM »
Agree with Boydie that it would be good if we can listen to the tracks.

Any chance you an share the name of the company?

devilsbones

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« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2012, 10:58:29 AM »
I`ve uploaded the song onto soundclick/devilsbones. I `d rather not name the company at the moment as I haven`t heard back regarding their publishing contracts or lack of them,so I might be questioning something legit. They are part of a well-established music group,which is why I think,as long as there is a publishing contract and I do not pay upfront,I should be okay. :)

Boydie

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« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2012, 11:33:48 AM »
I don't think they are doing anything that is not "legit"

What they are offering may be exactly what you need and could be a reasonable price

You have already recognised that this is primarily a "demo" service with the possibility of an extra benefit so you are going in with your eyes wide open

As long as the price is right you could end up with something significantly better

You are right to be cautious (and we are right to flagging up the warnings) but at the end of the day it is still very exciting to get interest in your work and as long as you keep your wits about you I am sure you will be fine...

...the "break" has got to come from somewhere  ;)
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devilsbones

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« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2012, 11:55:42 AM »
Sure Boydie,I`ve emailed regarding contract regarding publishing BEFORE I record the demo,and as  you`ve advised make sure the price includes EVERYTHING and won`t require top-up charges or extra recording. Cost-wise I`ve been given a price which is equivalent to  about three times the cost of recording a cd of THREE songs. I`d also like to know if they want to hear other songs and see what kind of direction I`m going in. By my reckoning that means I get a demo, some commitment that this is no `hit and run`, and they get,hopefully, a songwriter who may be able to generate income for them.  :) I`ve posted up what is imo the more commercial song of the two I sent in:
members.soundclick.com/devilsbones

Keep you posted.

Boydie

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« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2012, 05:04:15 PM »
What is the name of the track?

I found a few different ones under the name "devilsbones" on Soundclick

A direct link to the track would be perfect
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devilsbones

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« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2012, 09:07:09 AM »
Sure Boydie here it is  http://soundclick.com/devilsbones
Haven`t been on soundclick for a while so it looks like it takes a while for your upload to appear,so sorry.