[MartynRich]

I like it for a number of reasons, What the choice of the nominations of the person running it is, this can have a bearing on the votes, for example would I pick a death metal song for the shortlist? or would it need to be something I liked myself? and to vote, would I pick the best song, or the best production, or the most original? the least out of tune???

When I vote, I go for all the above.

Rich

I think as it´s a songwriters forum, it has to be on the quality of the songwriting only. Not everyone has the ability to perform or produce to a high standard.

[Skub]

@MartynRich

I hear what your saying,but folk will not be that way,not even on here.

The presentation of the song will be everything. So it won't be just the song judged,it will be how they hear and perceive it. All day long on the radio you can hear weak songs dressed up with high production values,whereas a scratchy home production of a great song won't even ping the radar.

[montydog]

@MartynRich

I hear what your saying,but folk will not be that way,not even on here.

The presentation of the song will be everything. So it won't be just the song judged,it will be how they hear and perceive it. All day long on the radio you can hear weak songs dressed up with high production values,whereas a scratchy home production of a great song won't even ping the radar.

Totally agree with Davy, sadly.

[MartynRich]

Well then we should aspire to it at the very least. Of course I know what Davy is saying and I know that´s how songs are perceived. Who doesn't like to hear a good production, performance on on-key singing? I know I do. However, this is a forum for songwriters so I sincerely believe that we must try to judge the quality of the song first and foremost, otherwise we´re no better than your average radio listener.

[pompeyjazz]

You see what a difficult job it is to run SOTM. I genuinely do try and look behind the production etc etc when I have the privilege of hosting. Sometimes there are some songs that have brilliant potential that I've included but other times I've been wowed by some production stuff that makes a song different and interesting. Every month I hear some amazing original songs on here and I love the fact that that the majority of guys on here are doing this stuff for the love of it and expressing themselves 

[Skub]

Well then we should aspire to it at the very least. Of course I know what Davy is saying and I know that´s how songs are perceived. Who doesn't like to hear a good production, performance on on-key singing? I know I do. However, this is a forum for songwriters so I sincerely believe that we must try to judge the quality of the song first and foremost, otherwise we´re no better than your average radio listener.

On a personal level I do agree with you wholeheartedly Martyn,the song is King and all must serve. I think with the forum title of 'Finished Songs',there is always the expectation when we click on a link,that it will be a polished and finished article. Perhaps if 'Works in Progress' was a more active part of the site,then really strong songs may not be as easily overlooked.
I am as guilty as anyone (perhaps even more so) of logging in and spending most time listening in 'Finished',rather than being involved in the process of nurturing works in progress. Given the constraints of time,I don't see an easy solution to that one.

I blame bin. 

[shadowfax]

So as the current runner of the SOTM my approach took into consideration that not everyone is (as yet ) good at production, it would be wrong to exclude a good song that is not a good production, having said that, good production is something all songwriters should aspire to because...when was the last time you heard a good song but badly produced on the radio?
If you have a good song it's worth making the effort to window dress it for the listener who will not bother to (or be capable of )
hearing the good song through a bad and possibly out of tune production...

of course, at the end of the day it's about the song..how could it not be!
I took all things into consideration when I chose the contenders... I think it would be wrong to choose based on your personal taste.. ie only songs that you like yourself!

and yeah..what are all those other members ( that never get involved ) here for..beats me

best, Kevin

[rightly]

This is an interesting discussion.

I think having to produce really gets in the way of the original creative impulse. 
It's not evil, but experience tells me it's necessary.
If I get others involved, the delay is terrible. I find I have to explain so much, in the listeners language.
Eventually, I might compromise and be left with something I'm not completely happy with, in which case the song is not finished.   
I've learnt it's better to do it myself, even at the expense of writing less.

I think I might be straying from the original topic. 
Production and performance are extremely important parts to experiencing a song.
I do also think it's important not to get hung up on the technical side of things.

The question is, did the song resonate with you, did it move, inspire you?

I remember digger72 posting a song, "a man reborn" I think it was called.
Technically basic, and a very simple song, very clever, concise.
It made me giggle and I found it so relatable. I remember feeling uncomfortable when my girl (a professional sound engineer) exclaimed she loved it and the next few days wandering about singing it. Yuk.
I can't recall a song ever giving me more than that one did.

Does the song touch you? 

[shadowfax]

This is an interesting discussion.

I think having to produce really gets in the way of the original creative impulse. 
It's not evil, but experience tells me it's necessary.
If I get others involved, the delay is terrible. I find I have to explain so much, in the listeners language.
Eventually, I might compromise and be left with something I'm not completely happy with, in which case the song is not finished.   
I've learnt it's better to do it myself, even at the expense of writing less.

I think I might be straying from the original topic. 
Production and performance are extremely important parts to experiencing a song.
I do also think it's important not to get hung up on the technical side of things.

The question is, did the song resonate with you, did it move, inspire you?

I remember digger72 posting a song, "a man reborn" I think it was called.
Technically basic, and a very simple song, very clever, concise.
It made me giggle and I found it so relatable. I remember feeling uncomfortable when my girl (a professional sound engineer) exclaimed she loved it and the next few days wandering about singing it. Yuk.
I can't recall a song ever giving me more than that one did.

Does the song touch you? 

I basically agree with your comments...I hate having to produce a song and would love to inflict my basic un produced songs on the unsuspecting listener, ( my life would be so much easier ) but it would do me no good, they wouldn't listen to the song long enough to be touched by it, and why should they, If I can't be bothered to make an effort to give them a reasonable listening experience why should they take time out to listen?
at the end of the day a good song is a good song but a good song beautifully produced and arranged is surely what we all aspire to..
A song should at least be in tune and without mistakes through lack of practice..a song..simple or not should meet these requirements..if it does then it is well produced whether it be in your lounge, bedroom or major league studio...

best, Kevin

[adamfarr]

When I have to consider these things I think these are all pillars of the house - so I’ll try to give credit for concept, writing (melody/lyrics), and arrangement and feel. Yes life would be easier (and I would release more than my current average of about 3 songs a year) if production wasn’t needed but it’s a skill to learn, mostly a pleasure and, I’d have to agree, a necessary part of what songwriting is these days...

[adamfarr]

@adamfarr Thank you ! You have just gifted me a song title 

Does that mean I get 50% of the publishing deal?! Don't worry, free to use (I don't have your wild imagination so won't be using it!). 

[MartynRich]

but I will say it would be nice if a new member didn't have to go through the usual family community approval committee group anyway

Personally I don´t think that happens. On my first month on the forum I was nominated with my first song and came third. I think there may be something in members taking time to be active, especially giving feedback on others´songs and posting regularly.

[Sterix]

@adamfarr Thank you ! You have just gifted me a song title 

Does that mean I get 50% of the publishing deal?! Don't worry, free to use (I don't have your wild imagination so won't be using it!). 

Um... lyrics about "Russian porn bots"... now that'd be a challenge!

[shadowfax]

A reminder to all those members who have not yet voted..VOTE!! please
competition ends 20th April midnight...

[crystalsuzy]

Just a bump to remind those who haven't voted yet, to VOTE!