The Songwriter Forum - songwriting reviews, tips and chat
Songwriter Forum => The Writing Process => Topic started by: darreldo on November 30, 2011, 11:27:10 PM
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when writing songs, i seem to be able to come up with good melodies and chord progressions and have everything about the song finished. except for lyrics. how do i get over this annoying problem???
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If you really can't write lyrics then you might want to get in touch with another singer/songwriter who's a bit better with lyrics
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write the lyrics first? After you get 1 line of melody, stop and think about lyrics?
Most of the time when I write, I have vaguely decided before doing anything, what the song will be about. It can be very loose, but it helps it give some structure and direction so when I'm writing the music, all kinds of ideas for lines or lyric are popping out.
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If you want to get into the habit of writing your own lyrics, I recommend getting into the habit of writing regularly. It doesn't have to be lyrics, but write something every day. Spend at least 30 minutes if you can with a pen in your hand. Getting into the habit will not only make it easier to break the block, but it will also give you pages of your own writing to inspire you, and you'll find bits you can use in your songs.
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Yeah I tend to just write the music first and think about lyrics later (which may be a bad thing i don't know). I use songnotes which i bought with an amazing groupon deal. (http://www.groupon.co.uk) This is when you play the music and it notes them down for you. I would reccomend it to anyone!!!
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Yeah I tend to just write the music first and think about lyrics later.
yes thats the way i mainly do it but i also do what tone suggested above & write down ideas & good lines as i think of them so ive always got a lot of lyric material ready to try on the music :)
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Yeah I tend to just write the music first and think about lyrics later.
yes thats the way i mainly do it but i also do what tone suggested above & write down ideas & good lines as i think of them so ive always got a lot of lyric material ready to try on the music :)
Actually that's true. I'll tend to go in with a particular mood or tone I want to evoke. For others I'll have an image, idea or concept and I'll try and develop those issues into melodies.
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I used to have the same problem.
Now I'll be the first to admit that my lyric writing is not great, but I stopped being embarrassed by them. That was the main thing holding me back.
Just find some words that fit with the groove and the melody. I can be nonsense at first. They can be refined when you get the feel but just rely on getting the feeling over with the sounds rather than the meanings at first, because.....
English is a wonderful language. There are many (abundant, copious, countless, divers, innumerable, manifold, multifarious, umpteen, various) different ways of saying the same thing. ;D
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yeah, alot of my problems is having a fear of the words sounding awful or cocky and have a fear of other peoples reaction and my embaresment. we all have insecurities!!!
maybe i need to scale back abit and not set the bar so bloody high and expect to write the perfect song everytime i sit down and write. it would be nice though.
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scale back abit and not set the bar so bloody high and expect to write the perfect song everytime i sit down and write.
You have hit the nail on the head my friend. Quality comes with practice, so just keep at it and don't be afraid to let a perceived "weak" lyric stop you developing an idea. You can always revisit an idea later when your confidence and techniques improve. ;D
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I 99 times out of 100 write the music first or at least the first verse (chord wise) and
then plug in my mic and let whatever the hell kinda crap is floating around in my head
come out, melody-wise and word-wise. Play around with the melody and the syncopation
until if find something I think is cool and fits the music well. Usually there will be one line
of the words that jump out of my mouth that I home in on and then usually I can build
I relevant story or theme around it.
They key is not to worry if people will find them clever, or sincere, or meaningful or whatever.
They are your lyrics, flowing out of your brain, and somewhere in your mind, mean something to you.
That's about as honest and sincere and meaningful as you can get.
Sometimes the lyric isn't even the hook and so is less relevant anyway I find.
There is a song I listen to called "Running with the Mothmen" by Lighterthief. You should look it up
on youtube. The video is insanely brilliant. The music is great. The vocals are great and I have no
idea what this song is about haha.
Some people will love them and some people will think they are garbage. It doesn't matter because the ones
that do will get it. Get you :)
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Get over the embarrassment of writing what comes into your head. Just let it spill out, and get used to reading lines and applying them to melodies. If it's no good then you can always cross it out! The main thing is, as others have said, is to get into the habit of writing ideas down and trying things out :)
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If all these ideas fail, you could always try a blood sacrifice to the Archdemon Shulgar.
Hey, it worked for the Beatles.
Need a high Iron diet though
Peter
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lol
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I believe what makes a good song great is the lyrisc. Can't be underestimated. Yes there are a few exceptions where a riff or a melodic idea is more memorable. But without that memorable hook line a song will never be elevated to a great song.
In tandem with this I put melody. Get the two to work together and u have a hit. Production, instrumentation can all come later...
I've worked with so many students who crank up their guitars, get the drums and bass in, and last think they think about is the lyrics and melody. Inevitably they come out with weaker songs. As the lyrics are forced into the music.
A good source to study is the great american songbook. Abundant in inspiration lyrics and melodies that have defined popular culture. Try buying a jazz real book, all numbers reduced to great lyrics and melodies...
Just thoughts...
Chris
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Personally, I think lyrics are subliminally more important than we give them credit for but it's a tough one because we're our own harshest critics. I often wonder to myself if some of my favourite songs would be my favourite songs had the lyrics been about something completely different, or had they not been able to stir the same emotional response in me.
I used to write with my best mate who I've always thought was a far better lyricist than I ever will be, but then he thought the same about mine. The danger is falling in to a trap where you're never happy with your lyrics and convince yourself they can be better even after a hundred re-writes.
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As far as favourite songs go, I have to say I'd not have the same set of favourites if their lyrics were different.
Songs are odd in that you can have an instrumental but for it to really have the same power as a song with lyrics it needs to be a journey, emotional or otherwise. It seems that lyrics are a more refined way of describing and creating this journey for the listener and with them more topics can be broached and physical wisdom can be imparted.
I can't remember what I was meaning to get at with that spiel.
Personally I think lyrics are almost always what makes a good song great, though there can be great songs with crap lyirics and great songs with no lyrics. Any good song can become great with great lyrics.
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Personally I think lyrics are almost always what makes a good song great, though there can be great songs with crap lyirics and great songs with no lyrics. Any good song can become great with great lyrics.
True for me, too. I do know people who listen to songs mostly for the music, but for me it's most often a lyrics-first affair.
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Try the lyrics first, or get the theme sorted first. I find it a lot easier to write if I'm writing about something, rather than try and work that out later. I used to write complete songs without lyrics and then get totally stuck, and then end up writing terrible lyrics to fit the song. I usually steer well clear of books about songwriting but this one is amazing...it talks about brain types and personality types and everything. I'm not exaggerating when I say it completely turned my songwriting around. Give it a go...I recommend it to anyone wanting to improve their work http://www.amazon.co.uk/Songwriters-Idea-Book-Sheila-Davis/dp/0898795192
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I agree with Schavuitje about letting whatever is in your head come out. Normally I will play about with a chord structure and when I find something I like I play it until I get 1 line of the lyrics and build the song from that.
I almost use it as a seed, everything else can make sense from that one line so it happens fairly quickly once I reach this point. Normally I will finish the song in the next 20 minutes or so after that.
Mat.
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I sort of come up with both lyrics and melody at once, though the melody is in my head. The lyrics and melody are basically built around each other. Unfortunately I haven't the skill on guitar to play that melody. I have the skill on bass and drums but not the equipment. Life is just terrible :P