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Songwriter Forum => Feedback on Finished songs => Topic started by: jacksimmons on May 30, 2018, 08:59:52 PM
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Hi guys! Back again! I know I take big breaks but I am always hovering even if I'm not active. I have been working on this song off and on for a while but have finally stopped tweaking it. It's another track for my 80s inspired EP.
It is thematically similar to my last one, Billy. This is about the old gay men you see in gay bars, who have often upset me because society was not ready for them to fully be themselves when they were young, and as a result they have grown old without someone to love, or having to love in secret. Hence, secret mover.
As always, thanks for any feedback!
Lyrics:
Let me in
Let me know how you really feel
Before morning fully comes
And this song is done
All the boys
Have their eyes on eachother
And you are like a ghost
Just an old man
You were a mover
You were a secret mover
You had the time of your life before the guns came down
And it all went wrong
You were a lover
You were a secret lover
But when the lightning strikes on this dullard town
You'll be dead and gone
You were there before bombs were
You were there when the first brick fell
You showed the boys who the boss was
You let the boys fall in the snow
Tell me how
All your darlings took the last train out of Warsaw
And you followed them to these Roman streets
You were a mover
You were a secret mover
You had the time of your life before the guns came down
And it all went wrong
You were a dealer
You were a dirty dealer
In black market love but now those days are gone
And you are free and useless
You were there before bombs were
You were there when the first brick fell
You showed the boys who the boss was
You let the boys fall in the snow
You met the tanks by the river
You kissed and got cold sores
But now your hands on the bar
They've touched nothing in years
You were a mover
You were a secret mover
You were a mover
You were a secret mover
Secret mover
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Hi Jack
Im always a fan of some 80s inspired music. You've got your synth sounds spot on and Im feeling OMD with maybe a bit of Pet Shop Boys. Love the melody and the references to the Berlin wall and secret lives.
The singing is great too. I felt it could be a bit higher in the mix in some places.
Nice work
James
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Hi Jack. I'm listening on repeat. This is a wonderful song. Possibly your best yet. Love the vibe, the delivery and the mix. Please stick around.
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Be assured that this information is good for those who are interested in this.
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Hi Jack this is excellent so good , good topic - good ideas - just flows right with a good vibe with that undercurrent of sadness - your voice is great fits the song perfect - sounds like an 80s type hit - pet shop boys - communards - I think in the right market, clubs etc this could be a huge hit .
Must be a contender for song of the month - I can't rate it highly enough- I think the lyrcis are good , subtle with a story lots can relate to
Thanks for sharing xxx
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Real professional track. Great mix and the vibe is excellent.
Your voice also fits in this track perfect
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Great song Jack!
I'll reply in full when I've had a few more listens.
Martin
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Im always a fan of some 80s inspired music. You've got your synth sounds spot on and Im feeling OMD with maybe a bit of Pet Shop Boys. Love the melody and the references to the Berlin wall and secret lives.
The singing is great too. I felt it could be a bit higher in the mix in some places.
Nice work
Thanks a lot @jamesh (http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/index.php?action=profile;u=19375). I always end up with the vocals slightly too low in the mix. I will go back and correct that. Thanks for the feedback
Hi Jack. I'm listening on repeat. This is a wonderful song. Possibly your best yet. Love the vibe, the delivery and the mix. Please stick around.
Wowzers. Thanks Micky, I'm glad you like it! dw, I plan on sticking around
Hi Jack this is excellent so good , good topic - good ideas - just flows right with a good vibe with that undercurrent of sadness - your voice is great fits the song perfect - sounds like an 80s type hit - pet shop boys - communards - I think in the right market, clubs etc this could be a huge hit .
Must be a contender for song of the month - I can't rate it highly enough- I think the lyrcis are good , subtle with a story lots can relate to
Thanks for sharing xxx
Thank you very much Katie, I am glad you enjoyed it. I had been listening to the PSB A LOT when I recorded this, so it's cool that you heard the influence. PS. Glad to have you back! Don't go anywhere, please. :)
Real professional track. Great mix and the vibe is excellent.
Your voice also fits in this track perfect
Thank you! Thanks for listening!
Great song Jack!
I'll reply in full when I've had a few more listens.
Martin
Thank you Martin, I look forward to it :)
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Really pretty. Love the beat. I can see this being huge in the clubs. I saw Erasure twice in the early '90s, and this brings me back to those nights. Best. Concerts. Ever. So yeah, really liked this. It's excellent.
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Yes Jack, just brilliant!
I think 80s has a certain coolness currently so I think it's very clever to have an 80s theme. This is very modern 80s if that makes sense. Billy was a great track and I think this would work great next to it in an album. I'm very impressed with your music, it is a fantastic listen. Lyric are very powerful. Production spot on!
I'm on my 4th, 5th? Listen...I dunno lost count! Just loving listening to this!
All the best
Darren
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Hi Jack!
Where were your songs when I was 17?!
You always write good songs but this one has the quality of being both easy to listen to and still being a bit of a mystery. The lyrics, the kind of dark synths. It's like a part of a bigger picture. Look forward to the Ep.
The only thing that comes to mind in terms of criticism is that the ending is a bit abrupt.
Cheers,
Martin
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Great sounds and a really interesting topic for a song. There's a wistfullness to it which really suits. And great variation (you were a xx, a secret xx) which all worked really well for me.
I'd have to say I was a bit confused by some of the historic images (falling in the snow? Roman streets?) but of course I know that your pieces often have a dramatic back story which in context makes total sense.
Great 80s vibe!
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You have a very tender pop voice that carries this genre very well. The 'Mover' chorus is very catchy. Maybe perhaps a little too subtle with the lyrics in that more repetition could have driven this home more on first listen. But maybe that's just me, Mr Obvious. But 80s were not that subtle, ha ha!
The track moves along really nicely though and still sits well into its 80s intended pastiche. I've played it three times now and it's an enjoyable pop song, with a great backing track - and the more you play it, yes those vocals are just so right!
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Hi Jack - lots to like here - love the energy and the vocals are sweet.
Sort of disco beat meets good lyrics to me.
Excellent production as well - nice to hear you back ;D ;D
Paul
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Thank you guys for all your amazing comments and feedback. I always appreciate anyone taking the time to listen to my tunes. I am glad everyone seems to like this one as it was my first departure in to real synthpop, I think. I'm having a lot of fun!
I'd have to say I was a bit confused by some of the historic images (falling in the snow? Roman streets?)
The Roman streets are a reference to the places near where I live like Bath that have retained some of that flavour. The snow, and guns and the bricks falling (Berlin Wall) are all references to eastern Europe, somewhere largely untouched by the Roman Empire. I have always pictured that the person the narrator is speaking to is eastern European - homosexuality being much less tolerated in the communist countries of the eastern bloc in the 60s/70s/80s than in the UK. So it's just to juxtapose the places this person has left with the snow and guns to the new place with the Roman history.
Thanks everyone!
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Hiya Jack,
I love the 80's. And I love it when I see that you've posted on here. Every song is always so accomplished, so different and interesting and with a fine melody. This is definitely no exception. Yet another fab listen. C x
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I love it mate! Anything 80’s is always right up my street!! Excellent production! Great track!
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Hi Jack,
I am a bit late to this,
Move over pet shop boys, there's a new kid in town.
Full 80's Vibe. great work dude.
Andy
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Jack I love your work, this is another Simmons classic, thanks.
I listened on tracking cans' which tend to be a little bass heavy...
I felt the LVox could have benefitted from doubling att 'You had the time of your life' line, just to pull it out a bit ,I found there were patches on exposed LVox, that is it was beginning to sound like it needed something different going on, I could hear you did it later in the song, with additinal syth motifs.
Anyways, just a little thing Jack, and assomeone else said, Pets Shop vs OMD, in fact it just struck me that a plucked Jazz bass might work on here? just a thought..
Hope this helps, and as another said, please stick around.
cpm
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Great 80's vibe to this, great vocals, spot on production, loads to like but I do have 2 comments to make and I guess they are somewhat related. First thing: to me the chorus is not distinct enough for my taste, I've listened several times but never got that ah-and-here-comes-the-chorus feeling, something I think is crucial for this style. Erasure and Pet Shop Boy set the bar pretty high in that department. I can't really tell is it is an arrangement thins (i.e. the chorus being to similar to the rest instrumentation wise etc.) or if it is a matter of the chord progression/melody in the chorus being to close to the verse to make it stand out.
The other thing would be a little lack of variation/dynamics, I just found it a bit repetitive, as an example, loosing that arp synth for some part would be a nice change. Just my personal prefs of course :)
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Great song Jack,
Definitely hints of Erasure.....even Sparks from the 70s.
Excellent lyrics too...like the topic too.
A good Listen,
Sandeep
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Always love your complex arrangements Jack. You've got a knack at knocking out a great pop tune. This has a real 80's feel to it. Great vocals as ever. Top stuff
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Great sound Jack...super synthy stuff....vocals great.
I'm a bit in the JamBrains camp though as far as the song goes.....waiting for it to kick off. Have to confess to not being a big 80s fan or PSB fan for example but they had big hooks which I was missing here.....wonder if you've made the mistake of putting too much emphasis on getting a good lyric when you know that nobody really cares about that in pop music...they want just those few memorable hook phrases...secret mover...to be BIG.
I might be talking out of my arse though.
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Hi, your stuff is always accomplished but I think this is the best thing I've heard from you. Great 80's sounding synths and the vocals in parts sound like Mr Bowie on his Blackstar album, which is a compliment. Very good indeed!
Cheers
Jamie
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Jack I love your work, this is another Simmons classic, thanks.
I listened on tracking cans' which tend to be a little bass heavy...
I felt the LVox could have benefitted from doubling att 'You had the time of your life' line, just to pull it out a bit ,I found there were patches on exposed LVox, that is it was beginning to sound like it needed something different going on, I could hear you did it later in the song, with additinal syth motifs.
Anyways, just a little thing Jack, and assomeone else said, Pets Shop vs OMD, in fact it just struck me that a plucked Jazz bass might work on here? just a thought..
Cheers for the advice! You're definitely right about the falsetto parts in the chorus, I will look to track those bits further. The whole lead vocal is actually triple tracked believe it or not, with the other two very compressed and EQd and set far left and right so that the words ar ea bit crisper in the busy mix. I will track the other part more central though to give it that actual thicker sound.
I'm not sure I would know where to start with a plucked jazz bass but I could give it a go! Thanks :)
Great 80's vibe to this, great vocals, spot on production, loads to like but I do have 2 comments to make and I guess they are somewhat related. First thing: to me the chorus is not distinct enough for my taste, I've listened several times but never got that ah-and-here-comes-the-chorus feeling, something I think is crucial for this style. Erasure and Pet Shop Boy set the bar pretty high in that department. I can't really tell is it is an arrangement thins (i.e. the chorus being to similar to the rest instrumentation wise etc.) or if it is a matter of the chord progression/melody in the chorus being to close to the verse to make it stand out.
The other thing would be a little lack of variation/dynamics, I just found it a bit repetitive, as an example, loosing that arp synth for some part would be a nice change. Just my personal prefs of course :)
Great sound Jack...super synthy stuff....vocals great.
I'm a bit in the JamBrains camp though as far as the song goes.....waiting for it to kick off. Have to confess to not being a big 80s fan or PSB fan for example but they had big hooks which I was missing here.....wonder if you've made the mistake of putting too much emphasis on getting a good lyric when you know that nobody really cares about that in pop music...they want just those few memorable hook phrases...secret mover...to be BIG.
Thanks for the advice, and I knew it would be divisive, but it was a conscious decision to keep the chorus part and the verses largely indistinguishable apart from the vocal melody/chords. I actually wrote the melody a while before the lyrics, which is always my process, and I liked the way that the "you were a mover/you were a secret mover" was more of a variation on the less moving verse melody than a proper chorus. I find that I like that about 70s/80s krautrock. You're totally right about people wanting a big chorus, but I don't think that melody really lends itself to a big chorus, personally.
Thank you for your comments guys, really appreciate it.
I love the 80's. And I love it when I see that you've posted on here. Every song is always so accomplished, so different and interesting and with a fine melody. This is definitely no exception. Yet another fab listen. C x
I love it mate! Anything 80’s is always right up my street!! Excellent production! Great track!
I am a bit late to this,
Move over pet shop boys, there's a new kid in town.
Full 80's Vibe. great work dude.
Always love your complex arrangements Jack. You've got a knack at knocking out a great pop tune. This has a real 80's feel to it. Great vocals as ever. Top stuff
Great song Jack,
Definitely hints of Erasure.....even Sparks from the 70s.
Excellent lyrics too...like the topic too.
A good Listen,
Hi, your stuff is always accomplished but I think this is the best thing I've heard from you. Great 80's sounding synths and the vocals in parts sound like Mr Bowie on his Blackstar album, which is a compliment. Very good indeed!
Thanks guys! Great to hear you all liked it. Really appreciate you listening <3
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Really love the 80s sound. Feels perfect for this song. I'm just picturing 80's music videos with people in glittery jump suits and fog machines.
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Yo Jack.
It's always good to hear a new song from you,since I know I'm going to enjoy the listen.
This is no exception. Good driving energy and your trademark fine vocals and exquisite harmonies.
Very 80s and very cool. :)
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You've got this down pat,
A touch of the Pet Shops, insistence beat and choice of chords and synths. and the vocals ad ex's all work a treat.
Catchy chorus too.
:)
Neil
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Thank you @Skub (http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/index.php?action=profile;u=20061), @Neil C (http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/index.php?action=profile;u=18856) & @Jzr171 (http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/index.php?action=profile;u=21225) for the feedback and for listening.
Thank you for all the comments and feedback on this song, I will take it away and tweak it. Happy to say my 80s excursion is coming along nicely and hope the album will be finished in a few months.
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I really enjoyed it. The topic is pretty unconventional, reminded me a bit of "It's A Sin" by Pet Shop Boys, vocally and instrumentally as well. The lyrics are vague in some places and straightforward in others, and I think you found a pretty good balance between the two. The descending strings at 3:26 threw me off a little bit, felt like they belong in a different song. Everything else is great though, keep up the good work!
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Hey Jack
Always look forward to your stuff.
My favourite aspect of this is the lyrics. Little pictures painted that sum up a whole life... you can really imagine the backstory of the protagonist, without you having to lay it on with a trowel. Very clever and delicately done.
Musically for me it's not my fave of yours, for similar reasons to Jambrains and the Viscount, I found it a little repetitive and didn't feel it got free of its leash like some of your other sparkling creations, but as you've said that was a conscious decision. And that does lend it more poignancy I guess, whereas a big pop hook might have cheapened the effect. So it's an album track not a single for me, but very accomplished none the less.