[Krisp]

Hi,

From my perspective this is an exploration of 'Gentlemen Vs Womaniser' and how men's values are influenced by other men.

The narrator (gent) falls for a women who he pursues madly, only to be betrayed by his best friend Tom (Womaniser).

I'm interested to know how clearly these ideas come across and whether others can follow the plot or are confused. Any other feedback welcome though.

I wasn't planning music myself but i'm always open to collaboration if someones interested!


V1
We swapped shy sides in Tom’s kitchenette,
An alter ego I’d never met,
But in wrong hands,
She was contraband,
So like a beagle I chased her steps,
Tom set me up swear I’ll never forget

CHORUS
Square the snare with the middleman,
Lips that share when he’s outta town,
Boys turn to men when they’re afraid,
‘cus men are man made.

V2
Contract’s up. We move into Tom’s spare,
Don’t worry he’s many nests to share,
In fact he’s good company,
When I’m not around,
Promise it’s just a new pal you’ve found,

CHORUS
Square the snare with the middleman,
Lips that share when he’s outta town,
Boys turn to men when they’re afraid,
‘cus men are man made.

V3
Late for flat mate drinks,
Floating through the cloud of lynx,
See your face,
Smiling,
Tom’s hand on your waist.

BRIDGE
Tom teach me before you fly away
What it takes to be a man today

CHORUS
Square the snare with the middleman,
Lips that share when he’s outta town,
Boys turn to men when they’re afraid,
‘cus men are man made.

[Paulski]

Hi Krisp and welcome!

OK bear in mind that I'm a Canadian, and unlike other Canucks I'm dumb as a stump.
So I didn't understand these phrases (at all :

swapped shy sides
Square the snare with the middleman
Late for flat mate drinks,
Floating through the cloud of lynx,

and this phrase seemed the wrong way about:

Boys turn to men when they’re afraid

So in answer to your question, to me the plot is not clear.
Also the lyrics don't set up the hook - how does the story show how "Men are Man Made"? And aren't men made by women (with a little help)

Paul

[Krisp]

Thanks Paul! Appreciate your comments 

I don't think you're dumb...I think i'm too cryptic! 


swapped shy sides = two people exchanging their shy personalities

Square the snare with the middleman =  getting even for a trap set by a middleman (Tom)

Late for flat mate drinks = I am late to meet my flat mates for a drink at a bar

Floating through the cloud of lynx = Walking through a room filled with deodorant (lynx is a popular young mans deodorant in the UK)

Boys turn to men when they’re afraid

This is supposed to have a double meaning:
a) Boys look to men to be role models
b) Boys become a man when they go through adversity. What type of man will a boy become after going through hardship?

how does the story show how "Men are Man Made"

Good question! I'm focussing on the way that Mens values/personality/outlook is influenced by the interactions they have with other men through their life.

The narrator is a 'shy' guy to begin with and needs to be 'set up' with a woman, who he falls for. But when he finds she's cheating with his best friend Tom, he just wants to become a womaniser like Tom. His view of what it means to be a man has been morphed by Toms actions. He is 'man made'.

[hardtwistmusic]

To answer your question, "No, your plot is not clear."  

And to answer a question you did not ask. . . which is "how can I write a lyric that IS clear?"

The way I write a "sung story" is to begin writing a lyric (either to a tune or not) and LET THE LYRIC (and storyline) FLOW WHERE IT WILL.  

Every time I try to "guide" a song to a conclusion/storyline/lesson I already want it to go, I come up with an unclear lyric.  

My suggestion is to clear your mind of everything but a basic start point.... start writing, and DO NOT try to steer the lyric to any preconceived notion of what it "ought to say."

Art is about surprising people.  My best songs have ended up with outcomes that surprised ME.  

The probable outcome when I try to write a song lyric to a preconceived ending or preconceived "moral of the story," is that it just isn't clear to other people, and that it usually isn't very good.

Hope that helps.

[Arkwright]

I'm not a great fan of explanations at the beginning of a set of lyrics posted for review. Mainly because if the song ever gets released, it's unlikely the listener is going to get the opportunity to have the lyrics explained to them beforehand and therefore I prefer to judge lyrics on their content as opposed to their explanation.

Unfortunately in this case Krisp you have a double problem. The story isn't very clear without an explanation but also isn't very clear with an explanation.

Now don't get me wrong, I love reading obscure, slightly off the wall lyrics. Anything that leaves something to the imagination always gets a thumbs up from me, but I'm just not getting this one.

I'm not in total agreement with HTW regarding guiding a song to a preconceived ending, as that's the way I tend to write and in the main it works for me. I almost set out a story board when I write a set of lyrics to keep me focused on the story I want to tell and the order in which I want to tell it.

On the plus side, you do have some good lines going on. I particularly liked the opening two lines of verse 1 and the first line of the chorus.

The basic premise for your song is fine. Falling in love and being betrayed by your best friend is as good a story as any, you just need spend a bit more time getting that message across.

Sorry if that all sounds a bit negative and I'm certainly no expert when it comes to lyric writing, but I have to call it as I see it otherwise I would be doing you a disservice.

Hope that helps... 

 

[josemar]

Great Title!! I was just a bit confused too with some of the lines, outlined by the Canadian dude

[Krisp]

Great Title!! I was just a bit confused too with some of the lines, outlined by the Canadian dude

Cheers! Yep no worries...I'll probably try and re-write the idea in a clearer way.

[Krisp]

To answer your question, "No, your plot is not clear."  

And to answer a question you did not ask. . . which is "how can I write a lyric that IS clear?"

The way I write a "sung story" is to begin writing a lyric (either to a tune or not) and LET THE LYRIC (and storyline) FLOW WHERE IT WILL.  

Every time I try to "guide" a song to a conclusion/storyline/lesson I already want it to go, I come up with an unclear lyric.  

My suggestion is to clear your mind of everything but a basic start point.... start writing, and DO NOT try to steer the lyric to any preconceived notion of what it "ought to say."

Art is about surprising people.  My best songs have ended up with outcomes that surprised ME.  

The probable outcome when I try to write a song lyric to a preconceived ending or preconceived "moral of the story," is that it just isn't clear to other people, and that it usually isn't very good.

Hope that helps.

Thanks very much for taking the time to reply..I'm really new to writing so it's good just to get feedback. I will probably try and re-write the idea in a more organic way in future.

Certainly wasn't negative and i'm glad for you to call it as you see it.

[Krisp]

I'm not a great fan of explanations at the beginning of a set of lyrics posted for review. Mainly because if the song ever gets released, it's unlikely the listener is going to get the opportunity to have the lyrics explained to them beforehand and therefore I prefer to judge lyrics on their content as opposed to their explanation.

Unfortunately in this case Krisp you have a double problem. The story isn't very clear without an explanation but also isn't very clear with an explanation.

Now don't get me wrong, I love reading obscure, slightly off the wall lyrics. Anything that leaves something to the imagination always gets a thumbs up from me, but I'm just not getting this one.

I'm not in total agreement with HTW regarding guiding a song to a preconceived ending, as that's the way I tend to write and in the main it works for me. I almost set out a story board when I write a set of lyrics to keep me focused on the story I want to tell and the order in which I want to tell it.

On the plus side, you do have some good lines going on. I particularly liked the opening two lines of verse 1 and the first line of the chorus.

The basic premise for your song is fine. Falling in love and being betrayed by your best friend is as good a story as any, you just need spend a bit more time getting that message across.

Sorry if that all sounds a bit negative and I'm certainly no expert when it comes to lyric writing, but I have to call it as I see it otherwise I would be doing you a disservice.

Hope that helps... 

 

Don't be sorry! Your feedback's really helpful. I'm going to work on making any plots much clearer in future.

I completely agree with you about having the explanation at the beginning- I didn't really want to do it but felt like I should for some reason.

[CMUK]

Not sure what style this would be recorded in but to me it sounded like rap/ kind of modern feel. First thing I'd say is beware writing a song about another guy that gets your girl because he's cooler/better looking/more manly/more of a womaniser than you. People don't really want to hear that as it's kind of awkward. Be the guy that gets the girl in the song or let it be on your terms and identify the thing in you about why you lost out. Don't make it about the other guy either in song or life. Woah bit too much advice maybe when all you wanted was song feedback. Sorry.

Anyway it reminded me of a couple of songs you could listen to on a similar subject.
First 'F**K You' by Dr Dre. Yes it's explicit (very) so if your young maybe give it a miss. This is to be taken with a pinch of salt but is about how to be with your women on your own terms.

The second is 'Anna Begins' by Counting crows. The lead character doesn't want to commit to the holiday romance until he realizes it's actually a big deal. In the song he's kind of talking to himself and how he eventually lets her slip away because he's not ready for that sort of thing.

Two very different songs but they explain what I was trying to say.