It all depends on the "intention" of a song IMHO
If someone wants to send it to a publisher, A&R person etc. then the fact remains that to stand a chance of being "picked up"
it needs to sound like a hit at the demo stage - which means a top notch song, top notch performance and top notch production
It really does need to tick all boxes
So when someone posts a song that sounds like a demo then all 3 factors need to be considered IMHO
OR - comments along the lines of "you would need to produce a full demo before submitting etc." would be valid
If, however, someone posts a song they have written "for themselves" then these factors are not so important - but if they have gone to the trouble of recording it with proper mics, multi-track, used some processing etc. I do not see the harm in people giving advice and feedback on how they can make the recording & sound better - which WILL make the song sound better
The same points could be made about performance - a good song performed badly takes some "imagination" from the listener to appreciate how good the song is (Publishers and A&R people do not have the time to use their imagination and may not be able to)
A bad song with a top notch performance and production will inevitably sound better - we have all heard terrible songs in the top 40!!!
A good song with a good performance and production will stand a better chance
I am sure (revole)around wont mind me using his track as an example
Here is his original song posted for review:
http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/song-reviews/coasting-from-the-sun-(acoustic-demo)/Many of the reviews, including my own, suggested a full band production to best "show off" the song
I liked the song so much I re-recorded it and produced it a bit (far from "top notch" but it was generally accepted as an improvement)
http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/song-reviews/coasting-from-the-sun-(boydie-demo)/ This is most definitely the same song but I think the production "shows it off" better
It hasn't "improved" the song itself but the drums, bass, guitar and vocals give a different vibe
Does this constitute a co-write? - I don't think so
Does it improve the song - I think so
I personally don't think you can separate songwriting from production as the production can change the feel of the song
Someone else could take the same track and turn it into a deep house club floor filler with the right production - same song but completely different feel
Without both songwriting and production being presented together it is difficult to hear the overall intention of the song
The Radio 1 Live Lounge CDs are full of great examples of songs performed completely differently - same chords and melodies but often the song is transformed with a different performance/production - sometimes for the better and sometimes much worse!!!
I definitely fall on the side of the fence that songwriting, performance and production for "commercial" intentions are intertwined
The song can be written on an acoustic - but the production is essential to show it off in it's best light
Therefore I feel production is valid to be commented on in the forum reviews- unless the OP puts info in saying that they are not interested in production comments of course
I 'd love to see a section on the forum for sharing songs which is separate from reviews. Not everyone is looking for a review, they simply want an outlet for their music after all the time that they've spent bringing their songs to life. If the listener wants to comment, they might be inspired to send a personal message or not.
I suggested exactly this back in April but the idea got shot down in flames
http://www.songwriterforum.co.uk/the-bar/'shake-up'-of-the-reviews-forum/